PSD files

C
Posted By
Carlos
Oct 20, 2004
Views
635
Replies
22
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Closed
Hi

Is *.PSD files a lossless image file like *.TIFF ?
Are there big differences between these two types of files format ?

Thanks
Carlos

How to Master Sharpening in Photoshop

Give your photos a professional finish with sharpening in Photoshop. Learn to enhance details, create contrast, and prepare your images for print, web, and social media.

BN
Brooklyn NYC USA
Oct 20, 2004
<Carlos> wrote in message
Hi

Is *.PSD files a lossless image file like *.TIFF ?
Are there big differences between these two types of files format ?
Thanks
Carlos

It is lossless. It’s the native file for Photoshop. It’s not like a TIFF file because you can’t save a TIFF as a layered file. For instance: when you do any sort of creating in PS you don’t work on one layer. You work on multiple layers – maybe layer 1 is your background, layer 2 could be a text layer, etc.

Saving in TIFF or JPG or GIF will flatten the image so that when you open it you will see only one uneditable layer. A PSD file is what you want to save when you need a file that you can edit individual layers.

Whenever I am working on something I save the PSD as Image Working File.psd or whatever the name will be but I always add WORKING FILE at the end so that I know what it is.

If you work in Illustrator you can export that file to PSD. It will flatten some layers though.

Chris
National Assocation of Photoshop Professionals
http://tinyurl.com/7267s NYC Design Boutique Campaign
B
bhilton665
Oct 20, 2004
From: "Brooklyn NYC"

It’s not like a TIFF
file because you can’t save a TIFF as a layered file.

You can save layered tiffs with later versions of Photoshop.

A lot of apps won’t be able to open them, but you can sure save them 🙂
T
tacitr
Oct 20, 2004
Is *.PSD files a lossless image file like *.TIFF ?

Yes. Photoshop would not be a professional image editor if its native format was lossy!

Are there big differences between these two types of files format ?

Yes, they’re completely different. However, they can do much the same things–save layers, save paths, save alpha channels, and so on. TIFF doesn’t support spot channels, but that’s about the most significant difference.


Art, literature, shareware, polyamory, kink, and more:
http://www.xeromag.com/franklin.html
N
nomail
Oct 20, 2004
<Carlos> wrote:

Is *.PSD files a lossless image file like *.TIFF ?
Are there big differences between these two types of files format ?

The terms ‘lossy’ and ‘lossless’ refer to compression. A PSD file is not compressed.


Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/
N
nomail
Oct 20, 2004
Brooklyn NYC wrote:

<Carlos> wrote in message
Hi

Is *.PSD files a lossless image file like *.TIFF ?
Are there big differences between these two types of files format ?
Thanks
Carlos

It is lossless. It’s the native file for Photoshop. It’s not like a TIFF file because you can’t save a TIFF as a layered file. For instance: when you do any sort of creating in PS you don’t work on one layer. You work on multiple layers – maybe layer 1 is your background, layer 2 could be a text layer, etc.

Saving in TIFF or JPG or GIF will flatten the image so that when you open it you will see only one uneditable layer. A PSD file is what you want to save when you need a file that you can edit individual layers.
Whenever I am working on something I save the PSD as Image Working File.psd or whatever the name will be but I always add WORKING FILE at the end so that I know what it is.

If you work in Illustrator you can export that file to PSD. It will flatten some layers though.

Chris
National Assocation of Photoshop Professionals

Huh? For a Photoshop Professional, you either use a very old copy of Photoshop, or you know little about the program. You can save layered TIFF files for a long time in Photoshop.


Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/
T
tacitr
Oct 20, 2004
The terms ‘lossy’ and ‘lossless’ refer to compression. A PSD file is not compressed.

The Photoshop native format is compressed, using RLE (run length encoding). —
Art, literature, shareware, polyamory, kink, and more:
http://www.xeromag.com/franklin.html
HP
helmut.p.einfaltNOSPAM
Oct 20, 2004
Johan W. Elzenga wrote:
Huh? For a Photoshop Professional, you either use a very old copy of Photoshop, or you know little about the program. You can save
layered
TIFF files for a long time in Photoshop.

Yesss… but there’s not very much you can do with them outside Photoshop — most apps puke when fed layered TIFFs.

Helmut

All typos © My Knotty Fingers Ltd. Capacity Dept.
N
nomail
Oct 20, 2004
Helmut P. Einfalt wrote:

Johan W. Elzenga wrote:
Huh? For a Photoshop Professional, you either use a very old copy of Photoshop, or you know little about the program. You can save layered TIFF files for a long time in Photoshop.

Yesss… but there’s not very much you can do with them outside Photoshop — most apps puke when fed layered TIFFs.

Who says the OP wants to use them outside Photoshop? Besides, that’s not what ‘Brooklyn’ said. He said that layered files get flattened when saved as TIFF’s. That’s nonsense.


Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/
HP
helmut.p.einfaltNOSPAM
Oct 20, 2004
Johan W. Elzenga wrote:
Yesss… but there’s not very much you can do with them outside Photoshop — most apps puke when fed layered TIFFs.

Who says the OP wants to use them outside Photoshop? Besides, that’s not what ‘Brooklyn’ said. He said that layered files get flattened when saved as TIFF’s. That’s nonsense.

We’ve agreed on the last point.
But what reason would there be to use something else than Photoshop’s native PSD format unless you want to export the file for some application or other outside Photoshop?

Helmut

All typos © My Knotty Fingers Ltd. Capacity Dept.
C
Carlos
Oct 20, 2004
"Tacit" wrote :

The Photoshop native format is compressed, using RLE (run length
encoding).

But it is a lossless compression, right ?

Carlos

"Tacit" wrote in message
The terms ‘lossy’ and ‘lossless’ refer to compression. A PSD file is not compressed.

The Photoshop native format is compressed, using RLE (run length
encoding).

Art, literature, shareware, polyamory, kink, and more:
http://www.xeromag.com/franklin.html
C
Carlos
Oct 20, 2004
"Johan W. Elzenga" wrote

… layered files get flattened when saved as TIFF’s. That’s nonsense.

So, you mean a layered TIFF file won’t be flattened when I save it, right ?

Carlos

"Johan W. Elzenga" wrote in message
Helmut P. Einfalt wrote:

Johan W. Elzenga wrote:
Huh? For a Photoshop Professional, you either use a very old copy of Photoshop, or you know little about the program. You can save layered TIFF files for a long time in Photoshop.

Yesss… but there’s not very much you can do with them outside Photoshop — most apps puke when fed layered TIFFs.

Who says the OP wants to use them outside Photoshop? Besides, that’s not what ‘Brooklyn’ said. He said that layered files get flattened when saved as TIFF’s. That’s nonsense.


Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/
T
tacitr
Oct 20, 2004
But it is a lossless compression, right ?

Yes. Photoshop would not be worth very much if it were not.


Art, literature, shareware, polyamory, kink, and more:
http://www.xeromag.com/franklin.html
C
Carlos
Oct 21, 2004
OK. Thanks for the informations.

Carlos

"Tacit" wrote in message
But it is a lossless compression, right ?

Yes. Photoshop would not be worth very much if it were not.

Art, literature, shareware, polyamory, kink, and more:
http://www.xeromag.com/franklin.html
BN
Brooklyn NYC USA
Oct 21, 2004
"Johan W. Elzenga" wrote in message
Brooklyn NYC wrote:

<Carlos> wrote in message
Hi

Is *.PSD files a lossless image file like *.TIFF ?
Are there big differences between these two types of files format ?
Thanks
Carlos

It is lossless. It’s the native file for Photoshop. It’s not like a TIFF file because you can’t save a TIFF as a layered file. For instance: when you
do any sort of creating in PS you don’t work on one layer. You work on multiple layers – maybe layer 1 is your background, layer 2 could be a text
layer, etc.

Saving in TIFF or JPG or GIF will flatten the image so that when you open it
you will see only one uneditable layer. A PSD file is what you want to save
when you need a file that you can edit individual layers.
Whenever I am working on something I save the PSD as Image Working File.psd
or whatever the name will be but I always add WORKING FILE at the end so that I know what it is.

If you work in Illustrator you can export that file to PSD. It will flatten
some layers though.

Chris
National Assocation of Photoshop Professionals

Huh? For a Photoshop Professional, you either use a very old copy of Photoshop, or you know little about the program. You can save layered TIFF files for a long time in Photoshop.


Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/

That was my mistake. I should have known better. don’t know what I was thinking. Thanks for getting on my case. Sure glad to know that mistakes are not to be made in this ng. That’s why I never bother posting.
N
nomail
Oct 21, 2004
Helmut P. Einfalt wrote:

Johan W. Elzenga wrote:
Yesss… but there’s not very much you can do with them outside Photoshop — most apps puke when fed layered TIFFs.

Who says the OP wants to use them outside Photoshop? Besides, that’s not what ‘Brooklyn’ said. He said that layered files get flattened when saved as TIFF’s. That’s nonsense.

We’ve agreed on the last point.
But what reason would there be to use something else than Photoshop’s native PSD format unless you want to export the file for some application or other outside Photoshop?

TIFF’s can be compressed with LZW compression. Even though PSD apparently uses compression as well, it doesn’t do a very good job with images. Here’s my results for a simple, one layered image:

PSD file size: 22.7 MB
TIFF file size: 9.7 MB

That’s why I save all my images in TIFF, not PSD.


Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/
N
nomail
Oct 21, 2004
<Carlos> wrote:

"Johan W. Elzenga" wrote

… layered files get flattened when saved as TIFF’s. That’s nonsense.

So, you mean a layered TIFF file won’t be flattened when I save it, right ?

No, it wouldn’t. Unless you use a very old version of Photoshop perhaps.


Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/
N
nomail
Oct 21, 2004
Brooklyn NYC wrote:

That was my mistake. I should have known better. don’t know what I was thinking. Thanks for getting on my case. Sure glad to know that mistakes are not to be made in this ng. That’s why I never bother posting.

Anybody can make a mistake. Nobody is perfect. But just as in the real world, you do get corrected if you make a mistake. If you can’t stand the heat…


Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/
BV
Bart van der Wolf
Oct 21, 2004
"Johan W. Elzenga" wrote in message
SNIP
TIFF’s can be compressed with LZW compression. Even
though PSD apparently uses compression as well, it doesn’t do a very good job with images.

That may be due to saving in compatibility mode, where a flattened copy of the layered image is also saved.

Bart
N
nomail
Oct 21, 2004
Bart van der Wolf wrote:

"Johan W. Elzenga" wrote in message
SNIP
TIFF’s can be compressed with LZW compression. Even
though PSD apparently uses compression as well, it doesn’t do a very good job with images.

That may be due to saving in compatibility mode, where a flattened copy of the layered image is also saved.

Nope. That is not checked in my preferences. And it shouldn’t make any difference anyway, because I clearly stated that I tested this on a *one layer* image. If the image is one layer anyway, there is no ‘flattened image’ to save in compatibility mode.


Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/
T
tacitr
Oct 21, 2004
That may be due to saving in compatibility mode, where a flattened copy of the layered image is also saved.

Photoshop’s native compression is RLE, a very simple compression scheme that works well only on large areas of solid color. A typical photographic image benefits little–perhaps one or two percent–from RLE compression.


Art, literature, shareware, polyamory, kink, and more:
http://www.xeromag.com/franklin.html
T
tacitr
Oct 21, 2004
Nope. That is not checked in my preferences. And it shouldn’t make any difference anyway, because I clearly stated that I tested this on a *one layer* image. If the image is one layer anyway, there is no ‘flattened image’ to save in compatibility mode.

A single-layer image saved in Photoshop format with "maximize compatibility" on will grow significantly if the single layer is not a background layer. (In fact, it will double in size; the flattened version saved in a .PSD is saved as a background layer, even if the image contains only one "real" layer.)


Art, literature, shareware, polyamory, kink, and more:
http://www.xeromag.com/franklin.html
N
nomail
Oct 21, 2004
Tacit wrote:

Nope. That is not checked in my preferences. And it shouldn’t make any difference anyway, because I clearly stated that I tested this on a *one layer* image. If the image is one layer anyway, there is no ‘flattened image’ to save in compatibility mode.

A single-layer image saved in Photoshop format with "maximize compatibility" on will grow significantly if the single layer is not a background layer. (In fact, it will double in size; the flattened version saved in a .PSD is saved as a background layer, even if the image contains only one "real" layer.)

The example image is just a background layer. And, as I have stated already, I don’t have compatibility mode switched on anyway.


Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/

How to Master Sharpening in Photoshop

Give your photos a professional finish with sharpening in Photoshop. Learn to enhance details, create contrast, and prepare your images for print, web, and social media.

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