What’s Wrong with Photoshop CS

T
Posted By
tmalcom
Dec 3, 2003
Views
1193
Replies
36
Status
Closed

1. Activation. No company has the right to make me feel like a criminal for buying their software. There are no arguments Adobe can make to remove that feeling. Even though I own a legitimate copy of CS, I will use a cracked version of CS as soon as I can find a stable one; I will not be stuck with an expensive piece of software that I can use only at the whim of a company I trust as little as Adobe. Having been through the copy-protection wars back in the 80s, I know from experience that copy protection never works for long; it was abandoned for that reason and the fact that it caused widespread anger among legimate customers when it malfunctioned. People who are going to pirate software will find a way to do so. The only thing it accomplishes is alienating legitmate users. Just ask Intuit.

2. Phoning Home. Every time I open CS on my home machine, it tries to connect to the internet. Not to localhost, but to a DNS server. There is no reason for it to do so, since I’ve already activated it successfully, but it tries every time. This is not something that makes me trust Adobe one bit.

3. Launch Speed. There is 10 to 15 second delay after CS opens and before it is functional. I have removed as many plug-ins and presets as possible, which helped the launch speed somewhat, but the delay after it opens is always there.

4. File Opening Speed. PSCS is 5 to 10 times slower at opening files than PS7. I have tested file opening extensively using the same files and the speed differential is consistent no matter what the file. Some files take as long as 20 seconds to open (on a 1.8MHz P4, 512MB, huge hard drives, Matrox G550).

5. Text. The underline indicating text currently in edit mode is annoying and there’s no way to turn it off. It makes text, especially at small point sizes, difficult to read, let alone edit. I’ve also had to reposition and rework text that was perfect in PS7. There is no excuse for trashing my existing work, but Adobe doesn’t seem to see any problem with doing that, assuming that a little warning in the ReadMe will smooth things over. This is the same attitude Adobe took when they removed faux bold and faux italic from version 5. it left many of us unable to edit work we had already done, but Adobe decided faux bold and faux italic offended their design purists, not to mention that it would help them sell more fonts, so they did it anyway. It was the beginning of my serious mistrust of Adobe…see points #1 and #2.

6. Actions. Some work, some don’t. Any action that involves Import or Export won’t work and throws an error stating that the command is "not currently available". I’ve reproduced the problem on two different machines. I assume there are other commands that don’t work in actions, but I haven’t spent the time to find out.

7. Version Cue System Tray Icon. I don’t use Version Cue and have no intention of doing so. I use different version control software (StarTeam) and there doesn’t seem to be a way to remove the icon from the System Tray even though Version Cue is turned off. A minor annoyance, but an annoyance nevertheless.

8. File Associations. Adobe confiscates existing file associations without asking and litters other associations all over my system. The most egregious is Adobe taking over the .ASP extension. I’m an ASP (Active Server Pages) web developer and after installing Photoshop, my projects don’t work until I reclaim the file association. CS still does it too.

9. Customer Service. In the ten years or so that I’ve used Adobe products, dealing with Adobe Customer Service has never gotten any better. I invariably have to spend hours on hold and then deal with either incompetence or ignorance. The representatives are generally pleasant enough, but sorely undertrained and seemingly disorganized. I delayed buying my personal upgrade for PS7 until after CS shipped, primarily because after working with CS for a week and seeing the problems with it I wanted to make sure I had a

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B
Brian
Dec 3, 2003
tmalcom wrote:

7. Version Cue System Tray Icon. I don’t use Version Cue and have no intention of doing so.

You don’t have to install Version Cue…
RL
Robert_Levine
Dec 3, 2003
Did anyone else read past number 1?

Bob
DM
dave_milbut
Dec 4, 2003
Phoning Home. Every time I open CS on my home machine, it tries to connect to the internet. Not to localhost, but to a DNS server

what ip?
SM
Stuart_McCoy
Dec 4, 2003
Don’t let the doorknob hit you on the backside on your way out. On second thought, I’m one of those design purists you speak ill of. I hope the doorknob leaves a welt you’ll not soon forget.
RH
r_harvey
Dec 4, 2003
10. Either Photoshop is too expensive, or InDesign is too cheap.

11. No support for Linux.

12. Slipping corporate image, in the minds of some loyal customers. Exacerbated by a few unhelpful comments.
VS
Vernon_Stevens
Dec 4, 2003
I think I’ll skip this round… it’s just more of the same.

VES
P
pope
Dec 4, 2003
tmalcom…you’re gonna love a cracked version of CS. It will add a euphoric dimension to your happy life.
L
LenHewitt
Dec 4, 2003
Yet another "Brief History of Whine"……..
SB
Scott_Byer
Dec 4, 2003

1) There’s nothing about Activation that should make you feel like a thief;
that feeling originates within yourself and perhaps you should think about why. Acitvation is NOT copy protection. I grew up with the same copy protection you did, and would never put up with trying to put that in a product. But I also won’t put naked bits out anymore. Period.

2) That’s Version Cue. Even when it’s off (yeah, bug). You can safely have your firewall block it. Once activated, Photoshop doesn’t need to contact the internet anymore.

3) If there are pauses where the CPU isn’t doing anything, change your defeault printer to a local printer. All our tests show that Photoshop CS launches in about the same time, which, given the extra functionality, is pretty darned good.

4) What kind of files?

5) None of the beta users complained, so it just slipped by. Yes, there should be a way of hiding the line.

Sorry about Customer Service. I wish there was something I could do about it.

-Scott
LH
Lawrence_Hudetz
Dec 4, 2003
There shall be no Whine.

Before it’s time.

It’s time? <running and hiding!>
DM
Don_McCahill
Dec 5, 2003

8. File associations…

You mean they are taken over repeatedly, or just after the program was installed (and pretty much every program will take over associations of programs it understands if you don’t do a custom install).

Now, if it is continually taking back associations, then I think you have something to complain about.

(Waiting patiently for my copy of CS, ordered before US Thanksgiving and expected in four days. I hope the guy at Canadian Customs who has been playing with it gets bored soon and sends it on to me.)
J
johnkissane3
Dec 5, 2003
C’mon you guys are running away to fast. I was looking forward to 168 messages on anarchy to corporate greed. Again.
LH
Lawrence_Hudetz
Dec 5, 2003
Corporations aren’t greedy, people are greedy. 🙁
RH
r_harvey
Dec 5, 2003
Are we starting again?

Thirty-three days, sir… still no sign of land…
VS
Vernon_Stevens
Dec 5, 2003
Hey, that’s like,

Corporations don’t kill people, people kill people.

Now the funniest takeoff on the NRA motto is something Eddie Izzard said;

"Guns don’t kill people, monkey’s with guns kill people. Just ask Charlton Heston."

LOL!!

VES
S
Sparkey
Dec 5, 2003

6) I have the solution for you, because it took me a moment to figure out
why the heck I was having this problem too; when you create your droplet, toggle the "Override Action Open Commands" box. Problem goes away.
LH
Lawrence_Hudetz
Dec 5, 2003
MY intentions, exactly, Vernon. 🙂
RH
r_harvey
Dec 5, 2003
Thirty-three days! We can’t go on much longer, sir. No new arguments since the fifth day… We’re done for, we’re done for!
PC
Philo_Calhoun
Dec 5, 2003
There are a lot of other major things that suck about Photoshop CS. I just haven’t found any of them.
RH
r_harvey
Dec 5, 2003
The kind of what-if scenario that might cause one to pause:

The problem is due to an error in the way certain dynamic-link libraries (DLLs) are validated. Currently, the installation process incorrectly interprets some DLLs as invalid, when in fact they are valid.

– Time-out code ambushes MS Small Business Server 2003 install? <http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/67/34375.html>

We’re done for, we’re done for!
T
tmalcom
Dec 5, 2003
Thank you, Robert Levine, Stuart McCoy, Vernon Stevens, LenHewitt, and pope, for your thoughtful, well-reasoned responses. As soon as I can come up with something equally insightful, I’ll let you know.

Scott,

Thanks for being helpful. You’ll never change my mind about activation, but I understand your position. Copy protection is copy protection no matter what it’s called and there are always going to be problems with it. I think it’s important for Adobe to understand the effect it has on long-time customers and that we voice those concerns. Silence implies acceptance.

The files that take an inordinately long time to open are interface prototypes and have many layers (no nested sets) of both graphics and text. The same file that opens in PS7 in about 5 seconds takes 20 to 30 in PSCS. The only printer I have hooked up is a local one (I rarely print anything at all), so it can’t be a network printer that’s causing the slowdown.

I’ll permanently block Version Cue, but you have to admit that from this side of the fence it’s paranoia-inducing to have it try to connect every time I open CS.

dave milbut,

The IP resolves to an AT&T server.

Don McCahill,

File associations aren’t constantly reset by Photoshop, but it’s a pain to have to reclaim them after an install or reinstall. There also seem to be an excessive number of Adobe file associations outside of common graphics file formats. I count at least 40. The vast majority are innocuous, but it would be nice to have to option of not making them, especially those that obviously conflict with other common associations like ASP. It also makes for a very long list to sort through when trying to figure out issues with other associations.
N
nagash2
Dec 5, 2003
Is PS CS contacting an Outside IP or is it version Cue?

Why is PS CS even contacting the outside world? Major Privacy Hole there. Someone is logging that call.

Tmalcom Do you have that IP?
LH
Lawrence_Hudetz
Dec 5, 2003
I see no outside contact going on with just PSCS.
RH
r_harvey
Dec 5, 2003
Is PS CS contacting an Outside IP or is it version Cue?

I’m watching your computer right now, and I don’t see any unusual activity.
SB
Scott_Byer
Dec 5, 2003
Thanks for being helpful. You’ll never change my mind about activation,
but I understand your position. Copy protection is copy protection no matter what it’s called and there are always going to be problems with it. I think it’s important for Adobe to understand the effect it has on long-time customers and that we voice those concerns. Silence implies acceptance.

Note that there’s a feedback link on the Activation FAQ web page (can be found off of the Photoshop CS page at www.adobe.com) – use that if you wish, it’s more effective than posting here.

Activation really isn’t copy protection – copy protection tries to do "something" to prevent you from copying the bits, and as part of that, usually has to do some really shady things. With activation, you can copy the bits off the CD and from machine to machine. It just won’t run until activated. This is a *much* different thing. It is here to stay (in spite of some really bad and botched attempts at it from Intuit and Symantec), and support for it will probably be provided by the next iterations of the operating systems. Also note that there is *no* private information transmitted during activation.

So, I know I probably can’t convince you of the difference between copy protection and activation. There is one, or I would never have allowed it to go into the product.

The files that take an inordinately long time to open are interface
prototypes and have many layers (no nested sets) of both graphics and text. The same file that opens in PS7 in about 5 seconds takes 20 to 30 in PSCS. The only printer I have hooked up is a local one (I rarely print anything at all), so it can’t be a network printer that’s causing the slowdown.

Lots of text layes can be slower by a good chunk – it’s getting converted into the new engine format on loading. Note that as long as you don’t use new features with those text layers, they’ll go back and forth to Photoshop 7 just fine (with a layout warning and some very minor differences). If you do chose to update them in Photoshop CS and save the file back out, the files should load much faster.

I’ll permanently block Version Cue, but you have to admit that from this
side of the fence it’s paranoia-inducing to have it try to connect every time I open CS.

Yeah. I’m not happy about it either. It’s only trying to connect to a server local on your machine, which would have been installed as part of the Creative Suite, but it does it even when disabled.

-Scott
SM
Stuart_McCoy
Dec 5, 2003
"Thank you, Robert Levine, Stuart McCoy, Vernon Stevens, LenHewitt, and pope, for your thoughtful, well-reasoned responses. As soon as I can come up with something equally insightful, I’ll let you know."

You’re welcome tmalcom. As soon as you post a thoughtful, well-reasoned topic I’ll be happy to respond in kind. Until then beggars can’t be choosers and whiners should have a little more cheese.

🙂
RL
Robert_Levine
Dec 5, 2003
Well said, Stuart. This is kinda like the movie Groundhog Day, except the movie was very entertaining.

Bob
RH
r_harvey
Dec 5, 2003
Well said, Stuart.

I disagree.

This is kinda like the movie Groundhog Day, except the movie was very entertaining.

I agree.
T
tmalcom
Dec 5, 2003
Scott,

Activation really isn’t copy protection – copy protection tries to do "something" to prevent you from copying the bits, and as part of that, usually has to do some really shady things.

I think writing anything to the boot sector of my hard drive is pretty shady. I barely trust the operating system to do that, let alone a copy-protection scheme. We’ll just have to disagree over the definition of copy protection…I obviously take a much broader view of it.

Lots of text layers can be slower by a good chunk – it’s getting converted into the new engine format on loading. Note that as long as you don’t use new features with those text layers, they’ll go back and forth to Photoshop 7 just fine (with a layout warning and some very minor differences). If you do chose to update them in Photoshop CS and save the file back out, the files should load much faster.

The files that are slow to load have been converted from PS7 and saved in CS. I expected them to be slower on the first load in CS, but they’re still very slow to open even after the conversion and I’m not using any new features on them. In general, the files have 20 to 30 layer groups (none nested), about 75% of those containing one or two text layers along with a couple of graphic pieces.
VS
Vernon_Stevens
Dec 7, 2003
Don’t mention it. I am an insightful, well-reasoned person, so that explains my response. Glad to be of assistance.

VES
JF
Joseph_Finnivan
Dec 11, 2003
I have to agree with tmalcom concerning the activation requirement. If a person wants to load a cracked copy of Photoshop, it is easily gotten. The activation is only an inconvenience to honest buyers. I upgrade my system quite frequently, and I’m at the point now where I’ve changed my hardware enough that I have to call Microsoft every time I reload Windows. I usually reload Windows at least once or twice a year, just to get rid of all of the junk that accumulates over time. I expect that I’ll eventually be calling Adobe when my hardware has changed sufficiently for them to think it’s a new computer.
-Joe
DJ
dennis_johnson
Dec 11, 2003
Fudge.

I had been planning to sit out this version "upgrade", and now I’ve discovered a friend has bought me a copy of CS for xmas. While I know there’s no one twisting my arm to install the thing, it would be hard to explain to my friend why I haven’t.

I hate xmas.
G
graffiti
Dec 11, 2003
I’ve discovered a friend has bought me a copy of CS for xmas

Did you shake the box?
DM
dave_milbut
Dec 11, 2003
Christmas.
TF
Timothy_Foolery
Dec 11, 2003
I wish my friends would by me CS for Christmas (keep Dave happy :))

Anyone?
P
Phosphor
Dec 12, 2003
It’s "Cripsmas"…in East L.A.

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