Activation stupidity of CS

"Ryadia_" wrote…

I run a digital print shop. One of the things I do is print

enlargements

from digital images. OK so this is not a commercial it’s about the

stupidity

of Adobe and the absurd activation of it’s software.

I’ve had CS re-activated 5 times since it was installed 4 months ago.

I

could never understand why, when I boot my PC after a session with a client’s camera hooked to my PC via the USB cable, this would happen.

Now I

know!

The cameras are recognized by Windows as being a new drive. Adobe put

the

activation code in the master boot record of your hard drive. When you

boot

a PC it straight away knows what drives it had when the software was activated. New drives equal a substantial change to the hardware and

force a

re-activation.

Than… use a card reader?!?

Life is easy, when you know how

Frans

Adobe and Microsoft have gone nuts. Customers are suspects in a potential crime. Usage rights are being restricted to single machines on expensive software suites like "Office" which you cannot put on your wife’s machine or your notebook. The only solution is to leave Windows for Linux and let the software nazis know why you’re leaving. Greed has replaced reason, avarice has displaced kindness and taking has overcome caring. We live in mean spirited and small-minded times.

I agree, they’re stupid. The ultimate result will be lots of bad will.

"Ryadia_" wrote in message

I run a digital print shop. One of the things I do is print enlargements from digital images. OK so this is not a commercial it’s about the

stupidity

of Adobe and the absurd activation of it’s software.

I’ve had CS re-activated 5 times since it was installed 4 months ago. I could never understand why, when I boot my PC after a session with a client’s camera hooked to my PC via the USB cable, this would happen. Now

I

know!

The cameras are recognized by Windows as being a new drive. Adobe put the activation code in the master boot record of your hard drive. When you

boot

a PC it straight away knows what drives it had when the software was activated. New drives equal a substantial change to the hardware and force

a

re-activation.

Just as long as my clients all had the same make of camera, no problems. When I hooked up my Epson ‘Picture Mate’ personal photo lab, the card readers in it were seen as new drives so CS cracked up and wanted to be re-activated. When I hook up my client’s Olympus, Canon, HP, Panasonic or Fuji cameras, they all show up as new drives and CS cracks up again and

want

to be re-activated when I re-boot the PC. What a bloody joke!
I won’t dispute how good (or bad) Photoshop CS is but when I have to shell out over $1200 Australian for the program and it does this to me, I get pretty angry. How dare Adobe dictate to me what equipment I can connect to my PC!

The PC in question is not connected to the Internet and for some quaint reason, Adobe’s "please wait while we transfer you to a consultant"

resulted

in a dead line for over 12 hours. India’s phone system is not reliable, it would seem. Not good enough by a mile.

I had to go back to version 7 at the weekend, just to keep my business

open.

Adobe have seen the last of me. I’d rather use a set of crayons than be dictated to by them.

Ryadia

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 01:02:59 +0200, "Frans"
wrote:

Than… use a card reader?!?

Life is easy, when you know how

Exactly. You can keep it permanently attached with a permanent drive letter.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

"Ryadia_" wrote in
news::

I had to go back to version 7 at the weekend, just to keep my business open. Adobe have seen the last of me. I’d rather use a set of crayons than be dictated to by them.

An idea off the top of my head… does the activation thing count with network drives or networked computers? If the readers were on another pc, and then the images were read into photoshop from there, would it need reactivation? Would this include the ‘mapped network drive’ feature that gives a networked computer a drive letter?

— minor rant follows —

I have never bought a package needing activation of this sort, and never will. Meaning that windows2000 will probably be the last os I buy from ms, and what software I have is considered outdated… if you buy into the notion that people need to upgrade every 6-8 months to do what they want.

Still havent taken the Linux plunge yet. But the day is soon coming… depending on when the next hard drive replacement will be.

Im highly considering making my next major computer purchase whatever variant of the G5 is available at the time (maybe it will be a G6 by then). But then again I dont know if this activation business is required on macs as well. I hope not. My G3, while a slow poke by todays standards, never gave me any trouble except for a zip drive that was DOA. And Ive never had to worry about viruses and spyware on it ;o)

Note to these activation using companies: With all the computer equipment everywhere, and more that is being added, and all increasing security threats that just seem to get worse, dont be surprised if more businesses decide to remove networks from the internet entirely.

Cheers :o)

"Ryadia_" wrote:

New drives equal a substantial change to the hardware and force a re-activation.

I just bought a MuVo player. This device is basically a removeable hard drive, and I do not have your problems.

I do not believe you for that reason.

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

Than… use a card reader?!?

Life is easy, when you know how

Exactly. You can keep it permanently attached with a permanent drive letter.

Maybe he does not have a USB port that he can always have tied up by the card reader? Maybe his clients cameras have internal memory and the camera must be attached to the computer directly?

"Ryadia_" wrote …

…. it’s about the stupidity
of Adobe and the absurd activation of it’s software.

I’ve had CS re-activated 5 times since it was installed 4 months ago. I could never understand why, when I boot my PC after a session with a client’s camera hooked to my PC via the USB cable, this would happen. Now

I

know!

The cameras are recognized by Windows as being a new drive. Adobe put the activation code in the master boot record of your hard drive. When you

boot

a PC it straight away knows what drives it had when the software was activated. New drives equal a substantial change to the hardware and force

a

re-activation.

Crikey.
Does this mean each time I turn off/on my external HD I’ll have to reactivate CS? I mainly use it for backup or to transfer data between computers. Does having a firewire instead of USB connection make it better?

Interesting … you have to have MicroCeph(TM) XP to run CS … doesn’t that have the same sort of hardware-profile activation? did XP give you and sh*t about the external ‘drives’?

I am in the process of installing in the very near future XP and CS, so it’s interesting to hear the hassles to look forward to ;-).

"ggull" wrote in
news:41451830$0$2647$:

Interesting … you have to have MicroCeph(TM) XP to run CS … doesn’t that have the same sort of hardware-profile activation? did XP give you and sh*t about the external ‘drives’?

xp pro does not require activation like the home edition does. But since I dont have it, if someone that does have it knows otherwise, please correct me.

"Ryadia_" wrote in message

I run a digital print shop. One of the things I do is print enlargements from digital images. OK so this is not a commercial it’s about the

stupidity

of Adobe and the absurd activation of it’s software.

I’ve had CS re-activated 5 times since it was installed 4 months ago. I could never understand why, when I boot my PC after a session with a client’s camera hooked to my PC via the USB cable, this would happen. Now

I

know!

The cameras are recognized by Windows as being a new drive. Adobe put the activation code in the master boot record of your hard drive. When you

boot

a PC it straight away knows what drives it had when the software was activated. New drives equal a substantial change to the hardware and force

a

re-activation.

Just as long as my clients all had the same make of camera, no problems. When I hooked up my Epson ‘Picture Mate’ personal photo lab, the card readers in it were seen as new drives so CS cracked up and wanted to be re-activated. When I hook up my client’s Olympus, Canon, HP, Panasonic or Fuji cameras, they all show up as new drives and CS cracks up again and

want

to be re-activated when I re-boot the PC. What a bloody joke!
I won’t dispute how good (or bad) Photoshop CS is but when I have to shell out over $1200 Australian for the program and it does this to me, I get pretty angry. How dare Adobe dictate to me what equipment I can connect to my PC!

The PC in question is not connected to the Internet and for some quaint reason, Adobe’s "please wait while we transfer you to a consultant"

resulted

in a dead line for over 12 hours. India’s phone system is not reliable, it would seem. Not good enough by a mile.

I had to go back to version 7 at the weekend, just to keep my business

open.

Adobe have seen the last of me. I’d rather use a set of crayons than be dictated to by them.

A quick Google search will lead you to a crack.
You bought CS for good money, it is on YOUR machine, give Adobe the finger and get the crack!

Stephan

"Steven Wandy" …

Than… use a card reader?!?

Life is easy, when you know how

Exactly. You can keep it permanently attached with a permanent drive letter.

Maybe he does not have a USB port that he can always have tied up by

the

card reader? Maybe his clients cameras have internal memory and the

camera

must be attached to the computer directly?

There are PCI-to-USB cards. A customer with a camera with "internal memory only" (do those exist? Don’t think so) should be asked to burn the files on CD-Rom. If or when not a burner is available, this client can’t be served.
You don’t print pictures from a person, who tells you that "he has a picture at home that should be printed", now do you?

Frans

"Theo" wrote…

Im highly considering making my next major computer purchase whatever variant of the G5 is available at the time (maybe it will be a G6 by then). But then again I dont know if this activation business is

required

on macs as well. I hope not. My G3, while a slow poke by todays

standards,

never gave me any trouble except for a zip drive that was DOA. And Ive never had to worry about viruses and spyware on it ;o)

True, no spyware yet. But plenty of problems (with CS) and piles of investment needed.
Hope your lottery helps you.

Frans

Same here. I also had noticed that when "someone" 🙂 uses pirated software it works better than legal ones, because user can use many kinds of "Fixes"

–Aki Ahonen

"The Doormouse" wrote in message

"Ryadia_" wrote:

New drives equal a substantial change to the hardware and force a re-activation.

I just bought a MuVo player. This device is basically a removeable hard drive, and I do not have your problems.

I do not believe you for that reason.

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

Yeah, right.
Customer comes in.
Them: "Can you print directly from my starburst 58 camera" or camera phone? Me: OK. If it has a USB connection I can print from it.

Custome passes over the camera. I hook into it and use Irfanview to display the camera’s (now drive J) contents. Customer wants 1234567 frames. I use the same program to print to my lab. I don’t even open Photoshop or use it for client work!
That’s fine. I print the shots, collect the cash and … Next please.

Next day I boot the PC. Open Photoshop and it greets me with the crap that my hardware has changed and I have to re-activate. "Reactivate now or close?"
No card reader on many of my customer’s cameras and why should I bother about that? Bloody minded Adobe. It doesn’t happen with a Mac.

Ryadia.

"Frans" wrote in message

"Steven Wandy" …

Than… use a card reader?!?

Life is easy, when you know how

Exactly. You can keep it permanently attached with a permanent drive letter.

Maybe he does not have a USB port that he can always have tied up by

the

card reader? Maybe his clients cameras have internal memory and the

camera

must be attached to the computer directly?

There are PCI-to-USB cards. A customer with a camera with "internal memory only" (do those exist? Don’t think so) should be asked to burn the files on CD-Rom. If or when not a burner is available, this client can’t be served.
You don’t print pictures from a person, who tells you that "he has a picture at home that should be printed", now do you?
Frans

I don’t use XP I have a copy of XP Pro but the first time I upgraded my hard drive from 40 gig to 120, it said I have to reactivate it immediately or shut down the PC. I used Norton Ghost to mirror the old drive to the new one. I just couldn’t be bothered. Especially with all the other issues I had since buying the upgrade so I just installed my old Win 2k and haven’t had a problem since.

PS doesn’t do it all the time, that’s the odd thing. I can use a 6 in 1 card reader or connect and disconnect my 10D camera and it doesn’t miss a beat. The latest burp came from reading an Olympus camera directly when the SD card wouldn’t let me read the files so I hooked directly to the camera. Windows reported a new drive. Next boot and PS cracked up.

I still haven’t re-activated the software. I’m using my old version 7 software until this thing is sorted out. The PC drives a RIP to my digital printer and I need the security of NOT being on the Internet to avoid previous calamities.

In any case. To be stuffed around during business hours just because some wealthy American company wants to get wealthier just costs me money in lost time. I don’t intend to tolerate such behaviour. Linux is not yet an option. The Gimp is just something else to get your blood pressure up. No, I think an alternative photo editing program is the long term answer. Which one is the problem. For now PS 7 will do but it lacks some of the stuff in CS I have grown to like. And after all, they don’t give refunds at Adobe, do they?

Ryadia

"ggull" wrote in message

"Ryadia_" wrote …

…. it’s about the stupidity
of Adobe and the absurd activation of it’s software.

I’ve had CS re-activated 5 times since it was installed 4 months ago. I could never understand why, when I boot my PC after a session with a client’s camera hooked to my PC via the USB cable, this would happen.

Now

I

know!

The cameras are recognized by Windows as being a new drive. Adobe put

the

activation code in the master boot record of your hard drive. When you

boot

a PC it straight away knows what drives it had when the software was activated. New drives equal a substantial change to the hardware and

force

a

re-activation.

Crikey.
Does this mean each time I turn off/on my external HD I’ll have to reactivate CS? I mainly use it for backup or to transfer data between computers. Does having a firewire instead of USB connection make it

better?

Interesting … you have to have MicroCeph(TM) XP to run CS … doesn’t

that

have the same sort of hardware-profile activation? did XP give you and

sh*t

about the external ‘drives’?

I am in the process of installing in the very near future XP and CS, so

it’s

interesting to hear the hassles to look forward to ;-).

In article , Ryadia_ wrote:

I still haven’t re-activated the software. I’m using my old version 7 software until this thing is sorted out. The PC drives a RIP to my digital printer and I need the security of NOT being on the Internet to avoid previous calamities.

Use a second machine for customer interaction and copying. Network the two machines together and use a shared folder to transfer the images. A laptop should be fine at your service counter while you use a high powerd machine to run your printer. There’s no way that I’d connect a piece of customer equipment to a machine that my business depends upon.

Neither machine needs to be connected to the internet although a THIRD machine might be nice for that. A linux laptop with usb drives to transfer the images TO THE OTHER LAPTOP for input to the system. That way you could accept images from internet connected customers for printing and still keep your CS / XP / 2K system without fear of viruses.

In article , says
….

I run a digital print shop. One of the things I do is print enlargements from digital images. OK so this is not a commercial it’s about the stupidity of Adobe and the absurd activation of it’s software.

I’ve had CS re-activated 5 times since it was installed 4 months ago. I could never understand why, when I boot my PC after a session with a client’s camera hooked to my PC via the USB cable, this would happen. Now I know!

The cameras are recognized by Windows as being a new drive. Adobe put the activation code in the master boot record of your hard drive. When you boot a PC it straight away knows what drives it had when the software was activated. New drives equal a substantial change to the hardware and force a re-activation.

Just as long as my clients all had the same make of camera, no problems. When I hooked up my Epson ‘Picture Mate’ personal photo lab, the card readers in it were seen as new drives so CS cracked up and wanted to be re-activated. When I hook up my client’s Olympus, Canon, HP, Panasonic or Fuji cameras, they all show up as new drives and CS cracks up again and want to be re-activated when I re-boot the PC. What a bloody joke!
I won’t dispute how good (or bad) Photoshop CS is but when I have to shell out over $1200 Australian for the program and it does this to me, I get pretty angry. How dare Adobe dictate to me what equipment I can connect to my PC!

The PC in question is not connected to the Internet and for some quaint reason, Adobe’s "please wait while we transfer you to a consultant" resulted in a dead line for over 12 hours. India’s phone system is not reliable, it would seem. Not good enough by a mile.

I had to go back to version 7 at the weekend, just to keep my business open. Adobe have seen the last of me. I’d rather use a set of crayons than be dictated to by them.

Ryadia

I’m probably about to jinx my entire setup, but I do about what you do, and have not had one problem. two p2p gigabit machines (ME & W2K Pro, which has CS) and wireless G laptop (XP-Media and CS). I plug in all of my cameras, card reader, and ZIP drive, from time to time. CS was installed and activated on laptop, before I installed the Nikon and Canon software. So far there has not been a problem with any of this gear (oh hell, I know I’m jinxing myself). About 90% of the time I have none of the photo gear, and do not use the ZIP. The other 10% of the time, I just plug n play. I use CS for RAW from the Nikon and one of several programs for the Canon, usually Pinnacle Studio for the DV capture.

I realize that this does not help you, but I’ve not had one hiccup. Now, all machines are on Internet through router and cable modem, and might "phone home" in the background, but so far there has not been any problem.

Good luck with your situation,
Hunt

On 13 Sep 2004 12:24:12 GMT, Ed Clarke wrote:

Use a second machine for customer interaction and copying. Network the two machines together and use a shared folder to transfer the images. A laptop should be fine at your service counter while you use a high powerd machine to run your printer. There’s no way that I’d connect a piece of customer equipment to a machine that my business depends upon.
Neither machine needs to be connected to the internet although a THIRD machine might be nice for that. A linux laptop with usb drives to transfer the images TO THE OTHER LAPTOP for input to the system. That way you could accept images from internet connected customers for printing and still keep your CS / XP / 2K system without fear of viruses.

Yea, go buy another machine, that’s the answer.

Frank /~ http://newmex.com/f10
@/

WoW! A lot to read!

I can’t be bother with all of the thread and think I have the gist of it already.

Y’know what the trouble is?

If cracked/copied/pirated software was used none of that would happen (or so I believe)

No way am I implying that cracked/copied/pirated software should be used. Such software is a crime and users as well as sellers are committing criminal acts.

However, I do empathise with a view that seems to suggest the customer as prime suspect number 1 when all the little devils pirating software seem to do so with impunity. It seems the same old story of punishing the 98% for the transgerssions of the 2% (or is it the 70% for the transgressions of the 30%? or … )

I am sure that a contributing reason is because there is no distinct opposition or alternative. Something along the lines of: "Oh we can’t do that! We’ll lose sales to XYZ" tends to be a corrective factor

Ah well – hey-ho

Articus

"Ryadia_" wrote in message

I run a digital print shop. One of the things I do is print enlargements from digital images. OK so this is not a commercial it’s about the stupidity
of Adobe and the absurd activation of it’s software.

I’ve had CS re-activated 5 times since it was installed 4 months ago. I could never understand why, when I boot my PC after a session with a client’s camera hooked to my PC via the USB cable, this would happen. Now I
know!

The cameras are recognized by Windows as being a new drive. Adobe put the activation code in the master boot record of your hard drive. When you boot
a PC it straight away knows what drives it had when the software was activated. New drives equal a substantial change to the hardware and force a
re-activation.

Just as long as my clients all had the same make of camera, no problems. When I hooked up my Epson ‘Picture Mate’ personal photo lab, the card readers in it were seen as new drives so CS cracked up and wanted to be re-activated. When I hook up my client’s Olympus, Canon, HP, Panasonic or Fuji cameras, they all show up as new drives and CS cracks up again and want
to be re-activated when I re-boot the PC. What a bloody joke!
I won’t dispute how good (or bad) Photoshop CS is but when I have to shell out over $1200 Australian for the program and it does this to me, I get pretty angry. How dare Adobe dictate to me what equipment I can connect to my PC!

The PC in question is not connected to the Internet and for some quaint reason, Adobe’s "please wait while we transfer you to a consultant" resulted
in a dead line for over 12 hours. India’s phone system is not reliable, it would seem. Not good enough by a mile.

I had to go back to version 7 at the weekend, just to keep my business open.
Adobe have seen the last of me. I’d rather use a set of crayons than be dictated to by them.

Ryadia

"Frans" wrote in news:ci3i11$1icg$1
@textnews.wanadoo.nl:

True, no spyware yet. But plenty of problems (with CS) and piles of investment needed.
Hope your lottery helps you.

I wish 😛

"Ryadia_" wrote in berlin.de:

No card reader on many of my customer’s cameras and why should I bother about that? Bloody minded Adobe. It doesn’t happen with a Mac.

Assuming your Mac is networked, read from that, transfer the files to the PC, then use photoshop. An extra step that shouldnt be required, but better than what you have to do now.

Or call Adobe and see what they say. If they can offer no solution then ask for a refund and stick with the previous version (I would). They could have a solution. XP uses the same system of using available hardware to determine the code, and I dont think it requires reactivation every time a USB drive is attached. But if Im wrong, I will put it on my list of reasons why not to get XP.

Frank Vuotto wrote in
news::

Yea, go buy another machine, that’s the answer.

and write it off as a business expense.

In news:Theo typed:

xp pro does not require activation like the home edition does. But since I dont have it, if someone that does have it knows otherwise, please correct me.

Yes it does require activation just the same as home edition. I think you’ve mistaken XP pro with the corporate multilicense edition which doesn’t require activation.

—
Odysea video production
Come dive with us!
www.odysea.ca

"Theo" wrote in message

Frank Vuotto wrote in
news::

Yea, go buy another machine, that’s the answer.

and write it off as a business expense.

Maybe, but you shouldn’t have to buy another machine just because of Adobe’s stupidity.

Stephan

In news:Stephan typed:

A quick Google search will lead you to a crack.
You bought CS for good money, it is on YOUR machine, give Adobe the finger and get the crack!

Stephan

Holly sh**, you’re right; a quick google returned about 72 000 hit, even one to fix the banknote thingy in the first page. If that doesn’t make Adobe change their strategy for the next release, I don’t know what will.

—
Odysea video production
Come dive with us!
www.odysea.ca

"Frank Vuotto" wrote in message

On 13 Sep 2004 12:24:12 GMT, Ed Clarke wrote:

Use a second machine for customer interaction and copying. Network the two machines together and use a shared folder to transfer the images. A laptop should be fine at your service counter while you use a high powerd machine to run your printer. There’s no way that I’d connect a piece of customer equipment to a machine that my business depends upon.
Neither machine needs to be connected to the internet although a THIRD machine might be nice for that. A linux laptop with usb drives to

transfer

the images TO THE OTHER LAPTOP for input to the system. That way you could accept images from internet connected customers for printing and still keep your CS / XP / 2K system without fear of viruses.

Yea, go buy another machine, that’s the answer.

Frank /~ http://newmex.com/f10
@/

Buy two, to be safe.

XP uses the same system of using available hardware to
determine the code, and I dont think it requires reactivation every time a USB drive is attached. But if Im wrong, I will put it on my list of reasons
why not to get XP.

I have XP SP2 and never had a problem with re-activation when attaching any USB storage device or camera. (Including card readers, two different Oly and Canon cameras, a Smartdisk Flashtrax and a Pentax Digibinox.)

Articus Drools" wrote in message
news:lwj1d.143$>

Quote/ I am sure that a contributing reason is because there is no distinct opposition or alternative / Unquote

All great empires crumble eventually – the irony is that most contribute to their own downfall through arrogance and greed.

There must be a limit to what you can do to usefully improve any program. What will probably happen is that PS will still be used by well paid professionals but other proggies will emulate and improve until the difference, for most people, isn’t worth the hassle or the expense. It won’t happen overnight but it will happen.

In my opinion you can already see this happening at M$. Their OS user base is being steadily eroded by Linux, many people think that there are better browsers than IE, Office style programs are common and reasonably priced or even free.

Personally I’ve moved from IE to Firefox and wouldn’t dream of going back. I also use Open Office – which isn’t perfect but it’s free, and I’m not going to pay the cost of the full blown M$ version for a few extras I won’t ever use. My next OS will probably be Linux – and once I’ve got it my kids will want it, I can provide support to clients who use it …etc etc and so the empire crumbles.

The Barbarians are at the gates – and I’m one of them.

(Sorry Hecate I can’t remember what that was in Latin)
—
www.micromountain.com

In article , says…

In news:Theo typed:

xp pro does not require activation like the home edition does. But since I dont have it, if someone that does have it knows otherwise, please correct me.

Yes it does require activation just the same as home edition. I think you’ve mistaken XP pro with the corporate multilicense edition which doesn’t require activation.

—
Odysea video production
Come dive with us!
www.odysea.ca

XP-Media Edition (basically Home), has not required it on my laptop yet, and it sees two different cameras, card reader, ZIP, and removable HDD via USB. So far, CS runs perfectly every time (fingers are now X’ed). I have a wireless to an always-on cable through a series of routers and a gigabit wired LAN with W 2k running CS and it sees even more additional hardware, from time to time.

Hunt

broga wrote:

Articus Drools" wrote in message
news:lwj1d.143$>

Quote/ I am sure that a contributing reason is because there is no distinct opposition or alternative / Unquote

All great empires crumble eventually – the irony is that most contribute to their own downfall through arrogance and greed.

The Barbarians are at the gates – and I’m one of them.

(Sorry Hecate I can’t remember what that was in Latin)

All that said. Over the years since version 3 of PS, I have paid Adobe thousands of dollars in upgrades. Because I still use PS 7 and will continue to, I bought CS retail pack.

The real damage is done now. Had I known at PS7, that upgrading to CS would not provide any ‘real’ benefit, I’d have saved my money. The only thing in CS I found ‘better’ than version 7 is the shadow and highlight adjustments.

OK so I got quite a few PS Elements copies laying around. I just installed one and guess what? It has a function called ‘fill flash’ which does what shadow and highlight tool does! Huh… Maybe the plugin will work on PS 7?

Linux and open office might be free but reallly… You only get what you pay for! Keep in mind the "pay peanuts, get monkeys" thing when you start considering Linux. It simply doesn’t measure up for graphic art. Macs are the only alternative but the cost of getting one of them to the same level as a PC is out of this world!

Ryadia

In news:Ryadia typed:

All that said. Over the years since version 3 of PS, I have paid Adobe thousands of dollars in upgrades. Because I still use PS 7 and will continue to, I bought CS retail pack.

A major waste of money if you ask me. You could have bought the CS upgrade and ran both the 7 version and CS concurently on the same machine (and you still can).

The real damage is done now. Had I known at PS7, that upgrading to CS would not provide any ‘real’ benefit, I’d have saved my money. The only thing in CS I found ‘better’ than version 7 is the shadow and highlight adjustments.

There was a demo of CS, you could have found that out before spending a penny. I still run 6 because it suits me fine, and I have other priority than having the absolute latest version, upgrading is not a mandatory option.

Linux and open office might be free but reallly… You only get what you pay for! Keep in mind the "pay peanuts, get monkeys" thing when you start considering Linux. It simply doesn’t measure up for graphic art. Macs are the only alternative but the cost of getting one of them to the same level as a PC is out of this world!

Tell that to Disney, they have quite a few movie out that were made in part or in totality on Linux box.

—
Odysea video production
Come dive with us!
www.odysea.ca

deco_time wrote:

Linux and open office might be free but reallly… You only get what you pay for! Keep in mind the "pay peanuts, get monkeys" thing when you start considering Linux. It simply doesn’t measure up for graphic art. Macs are the only alternative but the cost of getting one of them to the same level as a PC is out of this world!

Tell that to Disney, they have quite a few movie out that were made in part or in totality on Linux box.

Next you’ll tell me you have 100 PCs in a server farm just like they do? Oh yes, I forgot to mention the cost of the software, odd, so did you! And get it right… Linux only powers the file servers too.

Ryadia

"deco_time" wrote in berlin.de:

Yes it does require activation just the same as home edition. I think you’ve mistaken XP pro with the corporate multilicense edition which doesn’t require activation.

ok I will remember that ;o)

"Stephan" wrote in
news:bWm1d.5262$:

"Theo" wrote in message

Frank Vuotto wrote in
news::

Yea, go buy another machine, that’s the answer.

and write it off as a business expense.

Maybe, but you shouldn’t have to buy another machine just because of Adobe’s stupidity.

Stephan

I agree, but as was posted earlier using another cheap machine, or simply an old one that isnt used much anymore, that does nothing but interact with customer devices is a good way to isolate the expensive equipment that should never touch anything not owned by the business. It would also be a good computer to provide internet access (again as was posted earlier) so the others dont have to do so and risk these ms vulnerabilities that keep popping up.

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 03:26:16 GMT, "Steven Wandy" wrote:

Than… use a card reader?!?

Life is easy, when you know how

Exactly. You can keep it permanently attached with a permanent drive letter.

Maybe he does not have a USB port that he can always have tied up by the card reader? Maybe his clients cameras have internal memory and the camera must be attached to the computer directly?

Ever heard of hubs?

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 03:26:16 GMT, "Steven Wandy" wrote:

Than… use a card reader?!?

Life is easy, when you know how

Exactly. You can keep it permanently attached with a permanent drive letter.

Maybe he does not have a USB port that he can always have tied up by the card reader? Maybe his clients cameras have internal memory and the camera must be attached to the computer directly?

PS Can you name one camera with internal storage only?

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

"deco_time" wrote:

There was a demo of CS, you could have found that out before spending a penny.

Yes, or even go to the Adobe website and examine the features list.

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 22:41:03 +0000 (UTC), "broga" wrote:

Personally I’ve moved from IE to Firefox and wouldn’t dream of going back. I also use Open Office – which isn’t perfect but it’s free, and I’m not going to pay the cost of the full blown M$ version for a few extras I won’t ever use. My next OS will probably be Linux – and once I’ve got it my kids will want it, I can provide support to clients who use it …etc etc and so the empire crumbles.

The Barbarians are at the gates – and I’m one of them.

(Sorry Hecate I can’t remember what that was in Latin)

LOL! I can’t either 😉

I have too much software (read money) invested in Windows based OSs to change. But I wouldn’t want to anyway – it does what I want and I have had no problems at all. I use a browser called Netcaptor which uses the IE engine but where the developer fixes any security holes he can before MS get round to it. I also use Firefox, but prefer the former. I use an independent Mail client (The Bat) and lots of shareware – wherever I can, I use independent companies (i.e. read small or shareware and so on). However, there are some things I can’t do without and the choice comes down to Mac or Windows. And I’m happy with Windows. And I’ve never liked *nix based systems anyway 😉

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

Hecate wrote:

PS Can you name one camera with internal storage only?

I have seen keychain cameras for about $30 that have no external storage.

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 03:26:16 GMT, "Steven Wandy" wrote:

Than… use a card reader?!?

Life is easy, when you know how

Exactly. You can keep it permanently attached with a permanent drive letter.

Maybe he does not have a USB port that he can always have tied up by the card reader? Maybe his clients cameras have internal memory and the

camera

must be attached to the computer directly?

PS Can you name one camera with internal storage only?

Hecate,
There are more and more mobile phones taking photos, some are even getting almost good and none of them has removable memory media.

Stephan

The Doormouse wrote:

"deco_time" wrote:

There was a demo of CS, you could have found that out before spending a penny.

Yes, or even go to the Adobe website and examine the features list.
The Doormouse

I don’t have to justify buying a software package to you but just to clear the air… By the time I bought a DSLR camera and needed to open Camera RAW files. Adobe had convieniently removed the camera raw plugin for PS 7 from their site. My only alternative was buy CS or go without.

What is it about you doormouse that I find so offensive?

Is it because earlier you called me a liar?

Perhaps it’s because you just said I should have done some research when I had?

No, it’s because you never address the point of a thread. Instead you behave like Johan does and try to find something to create your own entertainment out of without contributing one eyeota of information to the thread. You are plain and simply just a troll.

Ryadia

Ryadia wrote:

Adobe had convieniently removed the camera raw plugin
for PS 7 from their site. My only alternative was buy CS or go without.

So, prettymuch, you had no choice but to upgrade. Earlier you said that you would not have upgraded if you knew more about the features.

Now that story has changed to, "I had to buy it for the RAW plugin".

I wonder why other people do not seem to have your problem with the camera?

It’s too bad that you do not have access to the Adobe technical forums – available to registered users.

What is it about you doormouse that I find so offensive?

….

No, it’s because you never address the point of a thread.

Isn’t it a shame that I can type whatever I want?

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

"The Doormouse" wrote in message

Isn’t it a shame that I can type whatever I want?

The Doormouse

Idiots usually do.

"Ryadia_" wrote:

Isn’t it a shame that I can type whatever I want?
The Doormouse

Idiots usually do.

Your village called. They want you to come home.

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

Steven Wandy wrote:

XP uses the same system of using available hardware to
determine the code, and I dont think it requires reactivation every time a USB drive is attached. But if Im wrong, I will put it on my list of reasons
why not to get XP.

I have XP SP2 and never had a problem with re-activation when attaching any USB storage device or camera. (Including card readers, two different Oly and Canon cameras, a Smartdisk Flashtrax and a Pentax Digibinox.)

I’ve changed CPU twice, graphics card three times, sound card, motherboard, RAM, replaced one optical drive and added a second and added a second hard drive and never had to re-activate XP. I think the only bits of original hardware in there since the initial install is the primary hard drive, floppy drive and the NIC. I have also plugged 5 different digital cameras into it over the last year or two 🙂

It all depends on how much you change and how often.

—
Mutley!! Doooooo Something!!
Fix Outlook Express – http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/ as recommended by your friendly neighbourhood MeltDown.

"Littlemoot" wrote in news:Z4F1d.434$Ua3.5031118 @news-text.cableinet.net:

I’ve changed CPU twice, graphics card three times, sound card, motherboard, RAM, replaced one optical drive and added a second and added a second hard drive and never had to re-activate XP. I think the only bits of original hardware in there since the initial install is the primary hard drive, floppy drive and the NIC. I have also plugged 5 different digital cameras into it over the last year or two 🙂
It all depends on how much you change and how often.

I think the NIC was the key piece as far as XP is concerned, since every one is unique. But I thought I heard other things would do it as well. Perhaps I was thinking of another product.

Theo wrote:

"Littlemoot" wrote in
news:Z4F1d.434$Ua3.5031118 @news-text.cableinet.net:

I’ve changed CPU twice, graphics card three times, sound card, motherboard, RAM, replaced one optical drive and added a second and added a second hard drive and never had to re-activate XP. I think the only bits of original hardware in there since the initial install is the primary hard drive, floppy drive and the NIC. I have also plugged 5 different digital cameras into it over the last year or two 🙂

It all depends on how much you change and how often.

I think the NIC was the key piece as far as XP is concerned, since every one is unique. But I thought I heard other things would do it as well. Perhaps I was thinking of another product.

Other things will, it depends on how often it’s done and how much you change at any one time but I don’t know any more details than that. The most I changed at once was a motherboard, CPU and RAM upgrade but you’re right that the NIC is key.

It seems that the CS activation is a little more sensitive than that for XP, which seems odd, but I haven’t made any hardware changes since I installed about 6 months ago – maybe the graphics card, I’m not 100% sure but that would be all.

—
Mutley!! Doooooo Something!!
Fix Outlook Express – http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/ as recommended by your friendly neighbourhood MeltDown.

On 2004-09-14, Littlemoot wrote:

Theo wrote:

"Littlemoot" wrote in
news:Z4F1d.434$Ua3.5031118 @news-text.cableinet.net:

I’ve changed CPU twice, graphics card three times, sound card, motherboard, RAM, replaced one optical drive and added a second and added a second hard drive and never had to re-activate XP. I think the only bits of original hardware in there since the initial install is the primary hard drive, floppy drive and the NIC. I have also plugged 5 different digital cameras into it over the last year or two 🙂

It all depends on how much you change and how often.

I think the NIC was the key piece as far as XP is concerned, since every one is unique. But I thought I heard other things would do it as well. Perhaps I was thinking of another product.

Other things will, it depends on how often it’s done and how much you change at any one time but I don’t know any more details than that. The most I changed at once was a motherboard, CPU and RAM upgrade but you’re right that the NIC is key.

It seems that the CS activation is a little more sensitive than that for XP, which seems odd, but I haven’t made any hardware changes since I installed about 6 months ago – maybe the graphics card, I’m not 100% sure but that would be all.

From what I’ve read, the nic is the key; the nic control more "points" in deciding whether a re-activation is required. It was even stated that it is best to have the same nic installed even if it wasn’t used!

Changing drives don’t matter much with XP as it is the IDE controller that is recognized as being changed or not. Still the nic can override the total points of all other items combined….

On 2004-09-14, Theo wrote:

"Littlemoot" wrote in news:Z4F1d.434$Ua3.5031118 @news-text.cableinet.net:

I’ve changed CPU twice, graphics card three times, sound card, motherboard, RAM, replaced one optical drive and added a second and added a second hard drive and never had to re-activate XP. I think the only bits of original hardware in there since the initial install is the primary hard drive, floppy drive and the NIC. I have also plugged 5 different digital cameras into it over the last year or two 🙂
It all depends on how much you change and how often.

I think the NIC was the key piece as far as XP is concerned, since every one is unique. But I thought I heard other things would do it as well. Perhaps I was thinking of another product.

Also the point count for XP re-activation zeros out after 120 days, so far.

"Littlemoot" wrote in news:PFG1d.520$ja4.6033532 @news-text.cableinet.net:

Other things will, it depends on how often it’s done and how much you change at any one time but I don’t know any more details than that. The most I changed at once was a motherboard, CPU and RAM upgrade but you’re right that the NIC is key.

It seems that the CS activation is a little more sensitive than that for XP, which seems odd, but I haven’t made any hardware changes since I installed about 6 months ago – maybe the graphics card, I’m not 100% sure but that would be all.

I wonder if photoshop lists a NIC as a requirement. All it says is ‘internet or phone’ required for activation, so I guess not.

"Stephan" wrote in message

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 03:26:16 GMT, "Steven Wandy" wrote:

Than… use a card reader?!?

Life is easy, when you know how

Exactly. You can keep it permanently attached with a permanent drive letter.

Maybe he does not have a USB port that he can always have tied up by

the

card reader? Maybe his clients cameras have internal memory and the

camera

must be attached to the computer directly?

PS Can you name one camera with internal storage only?

Hecate,
There are more and more mobile phones taking photos, some are even getting almost good and none of them has removable memory media.
Stephan

Well, my Nokia has got a 32 MB MCC card

"The Doormouse" wrote in message

"Ryadia_" wrote:

Isn’t it a shame that I can type whatever I want?
The Doormouse

Idiots usually do.

Your village called. They want you to come home.

No no, we said he could NOT come home.

Because it burnt down.

Ryadia wrote in berlin.de:

Linux and open office might be free but reallly… You only get what you pay for!

Does that include ms products?

On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 16:35:05 GMT, "Littlemoot" wrote:

Steven Wandy wrote:

XP uses the same system of using available hardware to
determine the code, and I dont think it requires reactivation every time a USB drive is attached. But if Im wrong, I will put it on my list of reasons
why not to get XP.

I have XP SP2 and never had a problem with re-activation when attaching any USB storage device or camera. (Including card readers, two different Oly and Canon cameras, a Smartdisk Flashtrax and a Pentax Digibinox.)

I’ve changed CPU twice, graphics card three times, sound card, motherboard, RAM, replaced one optical drive and added a second and added a second hard drive and never had to re-activate XP. I think the only bits of original hardware in there since the initial install is the primary hard drive, floppy drive and the NIC. I have also plugged 5 different digital cameras into it over the last year or two 🙂
It all depends on how much you change and how often.

Yep. IIRC, you can make three changes every 120 days. After the 120 days, it resets and you can make another 3 changes, and so forth.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 04:10:03 GMT, The Doormouse
wrote:

Hecate wrote:

PS Can you name one camera with internal storage only?

I have seen keychain cameras for about $30 that have no external storage.

LOL! I didn’t mean pinhole devices 😉

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 05:07:36 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 03:26:16 GMT, "Steven Wandy" wrote:

Than… use a card reader?!?

Life is easy, when you know how

Exactly. You can keep it permanently attached with a permanent drive letter.

Maybe he does not have a USB port that he can always have tied up by the card reader? Maybe his clients cameras have internal memory and the

camera

must be attached to the computer directly?

PS Can you name one camera with internal storage only?

Hecate,
There are more and more mobile phones taking photos, some are even getting almost good and none of them has removable memory media.

Sorry, but mobile phones don’t cut it as cameras. And never will as they will never provide the same control as an SLR/lens system, digital or otherwise.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

How about mobile camera phones?
Samsung 2.1 digicams?
I have a whole list of them Hecate.
Many more than you would at first think.

Most in the sub 2.5 megapixel range but a lot are capable of quite reasonable quality and this is why their owners still have them. The work-around I have now is to use an Epson ‘r’ series inkjet printer and plug the cameras into it, from their I can print them to my digital printer… Sort of like a remote access point via Epson’s card reader. How it works is not my concern. The fact it does is gratifying.

My problem is not that using Photoshop causes any hassles. It is adding drives like the latest problem (an Olympus camera) to a PC with Photoshop on it. Whatever made Adobe think they could tamper with a person’s computer this way is something I suppose will come out in future.

A friend of mine (a Wedding photographer) files his primary drive and replaced it with a much bigger one. He used Norton Ghost to move mirror his old drive onto the new one. Windows XP didn’t need re-activation but Photoshop did and he had the same problems as me… Couldn’t contact the activation people by phone. Boy, was he mad too.

If you even use a virus repair utility which replaces the master boot record (MBR) on your PC to cleanse a virus from it, you’ll have to re-activate Photoshop. The whole thing stinks and stinks enough for me to go out of my way to avoid any programs in the future with Adobe on them.

Ryadia

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 04:10:03 GMT, The Doormouse
wrote:

Hecate wrote:

PS Can you name one camera with internal storage only?

I have seen keychain cameras for about $30 that have no external storage.

LOL! I didn’t mean pinhole devices 😉

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

Tell that to my customers Hecate.
Business printing from mobile phones has increased tenfold in the past 3 months and looks like overtaking prints from cameras. Get the blinkers off man!

Ryadia
———–
"Hecate" wrote in message

Sorry, but mobile phones don’t cut it as cameras. And never will as they will never provide the same control as an SLR/lens system, digital or otherwise.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

"Theo" wrote in message

Ryadia wrote in berlin.de:

Linux and open office might be free but reallly… You only get what you pay for!

Does that include ms products?

————–
Absolutely. $260 for a 35

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 05:07:36 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 03:26:16 GMT, "Steven Wandy" wrote:

Than… use a card reader?!?

Life is easy, when you know how

Exactly. You can keep it permanently attached with a permanent drive letter.

Maybe he does not have a USB port that he can always have tied up by

the

card reader? Maybe his clients cameras have internal memory and the

camera

must be attached to the computer directly?

PS Can you name one camera with internal storage only?

Hecate,
There are more and more mobile phones taking photos, some are even

getting

almost good and none of them has removable memory media.

Sorry, but mobile phones don’t cut it as cameras. And never will as they will never provide the same control as an SLR/lens system, digital or otherwise.

A good photographer can use a mobile phone to take a good picture.

Stephan

"Ryadia_" wrote:

How about mobile camera phones?
Samsung 2.1 digicams?
I have a whole list of them Hecate.

What an ass.

Most in the sub 2.5 megapixel range but a lot are capable of quite reasonable quality and this is why their owners still have them.

I have one of those cameras. It uses smartmedia potato chips, which I insert into a USB reader. There are, like, a half-dozen storage solutions – none of which involve direct cable-to-cable connections.

… and plug the cameras into it …

Geez. I haven’t seen a camera that needed a cable in ten years. I really wish that Ryd would just up and tell us the truth.

It is adding drives like the latest problem (an Olympus camera)

I have an olympus 2050Z. Nice camera, for what it is.

If you even use a virus repair utility which replaces the master boot record (MBR) on your PC to cleanse a virus from it, you’ll have to re-activate Photoshop.

I see. Wait, I don’t see. How does adding a removeable drive wipe the master boot record of your hard drive?

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

"Stephan" wrote:

A good photographer can use a mobile phone to take a good picture.

That’s true, up to a point. A good artist can do amazing things with crayon. A crayon is still a crayon, though. There are limits.

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

"The Doormouse" wrote in message

"Ryadia_" wrote:

How about mobile camera phones?
Samsung 2.1 digicams?
I have a whole list of them Hecate.

Geez. I haven’t seen a camera that needed a cable in ten years. I really wish that Ryd would just up and tell us the truth.

I see. Wait, I don’t see. How does adding a removeable drive wipe the master boot record of your hard drive?

——————-
I didn’t say the MBR was wiped. I said Adobe store some code in it and when you replace the MBR, be it via Norton Ghost – copying old drive contents to new one – or just to kill a boot sector virus, it triggers a re-activation. You’re just looking for entertainment, aren’t you?

You wouldn’t be making the mistake of calling me a liar twice, would you?

As for your sight… More likely lack of it. Obviously you don’t run a high volume digital print shop or you too would see a variety of cameras, the simple way to get data from "potatochip" cameras is not to unwrap a new flash card and burn the clients batteries out copying the data to it just so you can read from it with a flash card reader but to hook the camera up to a pc and syphon the data off it.

Has your trolling caught anything yet? I haven’t plonked anyone in 10 years of the Internet but you could well be the exception here. Somehow you’ve managed to turn this thread into a personal attack on my credibility. You’ve called me a liar by saying you don’t believe me. Now you’ve passed off another insinuation I’m a liar, Why?

Precisely what are you trying to achieve here? I think it’s you who ought to come clean and tell us the truth about your intentions. Every post I’ve read of yours contributes nothing to a thread except an attempt to convert it to your own personal entertainment. Are you trying to de-stabilize this group and turn it into a free-for-all?

Take a hold of yourself and stop it. You don’t know me, you are not a customer of mine, you obviously have no knowledge of my ethics or you wouldn’t carry on the way you are. Just behave like an adult for a change and stop it. If you have nothing constructive to say, just read the messages. Anyone who can’t believe something just because they have never experienced it is a very sick person. The flat atlas got inflated a long time ago.

Ryadia

"Ryadia_" wrote in message

"The Doormouse" wrote in message

"Ryadia_" wrote:

How about mobile camera phones?
Samsung 2.1 digicams?
I have a whole list of them Hecate.

Geez. I haven’t seen a camera that needed a cable in ten years. I really wish that Ryd would just up and tell us the truth.

I see. Wait, I don’t see. How does adding a removeable drive wipe the master boot record of your hard drive?

——————-
I didn’t say the MBR was wiped. I said Adobe store some code in it and

when

you replace the MBR, be it via Norton Ghost – copying old drive contents

to

new one – or just to kill a boot sector virus, it triggers a

re-activation.

You’re just looking for entertainment, aren’t you?

You wouldn’t be making the mistake of calling me a liar twice, would you?
As for your sight… More likely lack of it. Obviously you don’t run a

high

volume digital print shop or you too would see a variety of cameras, the simple way to get data from "potatochip" cameras is not to unwrap a new flash card and burn the clients batteries out copying the data to it just

so

you can read from it with a flash card reader but to hook the camera up to

a

pc and syphon the data off it.

Has your trolling caught anything yet? I haven’t plonked anyone in 10

years

of the Internet but you could well be the exception here. Somehow you’ve managed to turn this thread into a personal attack on my credibility.

You’ve

called me a liar by saying you don’t believe me. Now you’ve passed off another insinuation I’m a liar, Why?

Precisely what are you trying to achieve here? I think it’s you who ought

to

come clean and tell us the truth about your intentions. Every post I’ve

read

of yours contributes nothing to a thread except an attempt to convert it

to

your own personal entertainment. Are you trying to de-stabilize this group and turn it into a free-for-all?

Take a hold of yourself and stop it. You don’t know me, you are not a customer of mine, you obviously have no knowledge of my ethics or you wouldn’t carry on the way you are. Just behave like an adult for a change and stop it. If you have nothing constructive to say, just read the messages. Anyone who can’t believe something just because they have never experienced it is a very sick person. The flat atlas got inflated a long time ago.

The Doormouse is free to reply in any way she likes, and you are free to ignore her. But the length of your replies to The Doormouse tells me you find it entertaining too, otherwise you wouldn’t be feeding her.

"V1nc3nt" wrote in message

The Doormouse is free to reply in any way she likes, and you are free to ignore her. But the length of your replies to The Doormouse tells me you find it entertaining too, otherwise you wouldn’t be feeding her.

———————
Hmmm.
You are right in the first part Vincent.
The second part?
I need to think on that a while but you could be right.

Ryadia

In article , The Doormouse wrote:

Geez. I haven’t seen a camera that needed a cable in ten years. I really wish that Ryd would just up and tell us the truth.

The current crop of digital video cameras from Sony (at least) do. They use "miniDV" tapes that I haven’t found a player for. You connect the camcorder to your computer with a firewire cable.

Most miniDV players that I’ve found cost three times what the whole camcorder does. There’s a JVC player available for a little less with a firewire output at about $2000 MSRP. I’d still rather use the camera output.

The above has nothing to do with Photoshop, but might apply to the video editing store that the OP has in India. I still maintain that with the equipment he has mentioned ( a RIP connected printer, and I think that was large format [24 inch?] ), he’d be much much better to have a disposable PC for his customer input and keep the real production machine locked up in a protected environment.

Ed Clarke wrote:

he’d be much much better to
have a disposable PC for his customer input and keep the real production machine locked up in a protected environment.

I agree. Once the data is in, the files could be transferred anywhere. Such a machine would be totally cheap, since basically all that is needed is a system to accept a cable and a network card.

Of course, he could also specify that the customers bring data in on CD …. CD burners ceased being expensive a long time ago.

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

"Ryadia_" wrote:

I didn’t say the MBR was wiped. I said Adobe store some code in it and when you replace the MBR, be it via Norton Ghost – copying old drive contents to new one – or just to kill a boot sector virus, it triggers a re-activation.

You have said that attaching new removeable drives like a camera causes PS to think that it needs reactivation.

Now you have mentioned that wiping the drive also causes reactivation.

So, if your drive is not wiped, then the whole mention of the wiped drive is fairly pointless, other than to confuse the discussion.

You’re just looking for entertainment, aren’t you?

You received PLENTY of help from others – more than enough to solve your camera problem. I am working on solving your other problem. It is not so easy.

You wouldn’t be making the mistake of calling me a liar twice, would you?

The solutions proposed by other posters are really cheap, and your inability to solve the camera issue leaves me completely incredulous.

Obviously you don’t run a
high volume digital print shop

Obviously.

Has your trolling caught anything yet?

Trolling? You mean like posters that ask questions and ignore all the advice sent their way, and have computer issues that no one else has seen? That kind of thing? 🙂

Somehow you’ve managed to turn this thread into a personal attack on my credibility. You’ve called me a liar by saying you don’t believe me. Now you’ve passed off another insinuation I’m a liar, Why?

First, you stated that adding a camera caused PS to need to reactivate. I have a digital camera and have never experienced this. Nor, from browsing here forever, have I ever (not EVER!) heard of anyone with a similar problem. Since this is a technical issue, a registered user could have called Adobe for help or visited their technical forum. There is an obvious conclusion to be made from that.

Second, You tried to confuse the issue by stating that wiping the hard drive causes PS to reactivate. Yet, you also state that your drive has not been wiped and that this does not apply to you.

Third, no professional in his right mind would let a clients hardware anywhere near his system without total confidence in the results. You are flailing around because client cameras keep screwing up PS? AND you keep hooking up their stuff? WTF is wrong with this picture??

Fourth, you have made no mention of your website or business presence on the internet, despite being computer literate with internet access. No one can see what sort of digital services you offer, and so your claims of business are slightly nebulous. Come on, here’s your chance to shoot down one of my little arguments! Just post a link to your website.

Those are the clear and unambiguous reasons why I think that you are a liar. Originally, it was just the first reason, but you keep digging.

Precisely what are you trying to achieve here? I think it’s you who ought to come clean and tell us the truth about your intentions.

I am fascinated by your inability to solve this issue and also your completely unique problem, plus your antagonism towards Adobe. You seem disingenuous to me, and it is fascinating watching you.

Take a hold of yourself and stop it. You don’t know me, you are not a customer of mine, you obviously have no knowledge of my ethics or you wouldn’t carry on the way you are.

Your posts tell me everything that I would want to know. As for stopping, that is totally up to you.

Just behave like an adult for a
change and stop it. If you have nothing constructive to say, just read the messages.

Sadly, you do not get to determine how I read or post to usenet. Isn’t it a shame that I can post like I do? Oh wait. We’ve been here before.

Anyone who can’t believe something just because they
have never experienced it is a very sick person.

I would have accepted corroboration from others, which frankly, is not forthcoming. At this point, it would be pointless anyway.

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

The Doormouse wrote:
….

I would have accepted corroboration from others, which frankly, is not forthcoming. At this point, it would be pointless anyway.

LOL – most people just stand back when the sparks start flying. But not der Curvemeister!

Pointless or not, Doormouse, I for one think you’ve done very well indeed. You’ve tried to address the original quesiton constructively and given good information in the face of a hostile reception.
—

Mike Russell
www.curvemeister.com
www.geigy.2y.net

in article , The Doormouse at
wrote on 09/15/2004 5:43 AM:

I agree. Once the data is in, the files could be transferred anywhere. Such a machine would be totally cheap, since basically all that is needed is a system to accept a cable and a network card.

Maybe he should hire someone like
http://www.artistmike.com to do it for him.

in article , The Doormouse at
wrote on 09/14/2004 8:46 PM:

"Stephan" wrote:

A good photographer can use a mobile phone to take a good picture.

That’s true, up to a point. A good artist can do amazing things with crayon. A crayon is still a crayon, though. There are limits. But an Artist http://www.artistmike.com does not have the same limitations as other people.

The Doormouse

So true.

in article , Ryadia_ at
wrote on 09/15/2004 2:17 AM:

Precisely what are you trying to achieve here? I think it’s you who ought to come clean and tell us the truth about your intentions. Maybe you just want everyone to go to http://www.artistmike.com ? Is that it?
Ryadia

That is not a bad thing.

in article b740a$41480e72$3e3be867$, V1nc3nt at
wrote on 09/15/2004 2:43 AM:

The Doormouse is free to reply in any way she likes, and you are free to ignore her. But the length of your replies to The Doormouse tells me you like going to http://www.artistmike.com .

Who would not enjoy that?

in article , Ryadia_ at
wrote on 09/15/2004 4:30 AM:

"V1nc3nt" wrote in message

The Doormouse is free to reply in any way she likes, and you are free to ignore her. But the length of your replies to The Doormouse tells me you like going to http://www.artistmike.com .

———————
Hmmm.
You are right.

Who would not like such a thing?

hmmm – I read this with interest

Keep posting all

Articus

Hecate wrote in
news::

Yep. IIRC, you can make three changes every 120 days. After the 120 days, it resets and you can make another 3 changes, and so forth.

Well thats not good either. I wonder how they came up with "3" and "120"

"Ryadia_" wrote in berlin.de:

Absolutely. $260 for a 35

in article , Theo at
wrote on 09/15/2004 10:42 AM:

Hecate wrote in
news::

Yep. IIRC, you can make three changes every 120 days. After the 120 days, it resets and you can make another 3 changes, and so forth.

Well thats not good either. I recommend http://www.artistmike.com

I agree.

in article , Theo at
wrote on 09/15/2004 10:43 AM:

"Ryadia_" wrote in berlin.de:

Absolutely. $260 for a 35½ piece of Bio-degradable plastic. That sounds right, doesn’t it?
Your problem is that you can’t see value when it hits you in the eye!

Well a famous father in an even more famous movie once said the future is http://www.artistmike.com

So true.

I actually took Ed Clark’s advise before he offered it.
I have separated the system and installed yet another PC (how many is too many?) with my old A4 digital printer attached to it just for people who need to attach a devise to it. I had hoped to put it all in a housing and call it a kiosk but that might come later. I like the idea of a disposable PC. Maybe I could connect disposable cameras to it? NOT!

So… In case you are interested in how I fixed the activation problem. I followed an earlier posters recommendation to search Google for an activation crack. It worked on reactivating the program and to answer your earlier insinuation. I have a legal, boxed retail copy of Photoshop CS I bought locally. I also have (an unused) upgrade which I bought whilst in the USA last month as well as licensed copies of every version since 3.

One of the problems with telling customers with camera phones and digital cameras but no computer that you want the files on a CD is that you tend to lose business when they don’t do that! I can’t believe you even suggested that. Customer service is what drives a service business. If you don’t give people what they want, they go away and take their money with them.

Ryadia
————
"The Doormouse" wrote in message

Ed Clarke wrote:

he’d be much much better to
have a disposable PC for his customer input and keep the real production machine locked up in a protected environment.

I agree. Once the data is in, the files could be transferred anywhere. Such a machine would be totally cheap, since basically all that is needed is a system to accept a cable and a network card.
Of course, he could also specify that the customers bring data in on CD … CD burners ceased being expensive a long time ago.

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

in article , Ryadia_ at
wrote on 09/15/2004 12:06 PM:

I actually took Ed Clark’s advise and went to http://www.artistmike.com .
So… In case you are interested in how I fixed all my problems, I just went to http://www.artistmike.com and fixed my problems. I followed an earlier posters recommendation to search Google for http://www.artistmike.com and it worked great.

One of the problems with telling customers about http://www.artistmike.com is that you tend to lose business when they go there, but it can’t be helped. It is the best site on the web.

Customer service is what drives a service business, so I just have to send people to http://www.artistmike.com . No way around it.

You are right, it can’t be gotten away from, it is the best site.

"Ryadia_" wrote:

I can’t believe you even suggested
that. Customer service is what drives a service business. If you don’t give people what they want, they go away and take their money with them.

Sometimes, it is best to tell a customer, "no". The customer with his camera phone graphics is one of those.

IMO.

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

Thank you! 🙂

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 11:45:45 +1000, "Ryadia_"
wrote:

How about mobile camera phones?
Samsung 2.1 digicams?
I have a whole list of them Hecate.
Many more than you would at first think.

Oh, I’m sorry, I thought you were talking about photography rather than snaps.

My problem is not that using Photoshop causes any hassles. It is adding drives like the latest problem (an Olympus camera) to a PC with Photoshop on it. Whatever made Adobe think they could tamper with a person’s computer this way is something I suppose will come out in future.

Adding drives? How many times do you need to add a card reader?

A friend of mine (a Wedding photographer) files his primary drive and replaced it with a much bigger one. He used Norton Ghost to move mirror his old drive onto the new one. Windows XP didn’t need re-activation but Photoshop did and he had the same problems as me… Couldn’t contact the activation people by phone. Boy, was he mad too.

Funny that. I recently added a drive. No problem. I have a firewire drive attached. Sometimes I remove it to attach to another computer which also has PS on it. And then I reattach. No problem.

If you even use a virus repair utility which replaces the master boot record (MBR) on your PC to cleanse a virus from it, you’ll have to re-activate Photoshop. The whole thing stinks and stinks enough for me to go out of my way to avoid any programs in the future with Adobe on them.

I wouldn’t know about that as I’ve never had a virus since c.1990.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 19:17:54 +1000, "Ryadia_"
wrote:

"The Doormouse" wrote in message

"Ryadia_" wrote:

How about mobile camera phones?
Samsung 2.1 digicams?
I have a whole list of them Hecate.

Geez. I haven’t seen a camera that needed a cable in ten years. I really wish that Ryd would just up and tell us the truth.

I see. Wait, I don’t see. How does adding a removeable drive wipe the master boot record of your hard drive?

——————-
I didn’t say the MBR was wiped. I said Adobe store some code in it and when you replace the MBR, be it via Norton Ghost – copying old drive contents to new one – or just to kill a boot sector virus, it triggers a re-activation. You’re just looking for entertainment, aren’t you?

I take it this means that you don’t have a suitable backup – for instance Acronis True Image? Recreating the drive from that would mean that there wouldn’t be a problem, even if there was one in the first place.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 11:48:34 +1000, "Ryadia_"
wrote:

Tell that to my customers Hecate.
Business printing from mobile phones has increased tenfold in the past 3 months and looks like overtaking prints from cameras. Get the blinkers off man!

I’m not a man. Perhaps that’s why I look for solutions instead of whining about why I can’t do this or the other.

As for printing from mobiles – no doubt it’s a useful little niche business which will probably last as long as it takes for the customer to realise that for pictures of that quality they can do it far more cheaply at home.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 03:30:26 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

Sorry, but mobile phones don’t cut it as cameras. And never will as they will never provide the same control as an SLR/lens system, digital or otherwise.

A good photographer can use a mobile phone to take a good picture.

Maybe. But the question really is, why would a *good* photographer want to so? Come on, do you take a mobile out with you to shoot? Even as a pocket camera? I certainly don’t, and wouldn’t. Even the more basic digital cameras which are pocketable produce far better images and give you more control. Mobiles are fine for the "Oooh, look ma, see what I got up to at the party" type pictures, but for anything else – you may as well buy a disposable – they’d give you a better picture.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 17:42:25 -0000, Theo wrote:

Hecate wrote in
news::

Yep. IIRC, you can make three changes every 120 days. After the 120 days, it resets and you can make another 3 changes, and so forth.

Well thats not good either. I wonder how they came up with "3" and "120"

Well, how many times in 120 days do you change your system substantially? I.e. add a new hard disk, more memory, hardware changes like that? (If you want a full list go to the MS site).

As for how they came up with it, they probably got a media company to do a survey and see how the changes that would activate "activation" were likely to occur for most people and then picked a conservative figure.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

Hecate wrote:

I’m not a man. Perhaps that’s why I look for solutions instead of whining about why I can’t do this or the other.

Perhaps it is. 🙂

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 11:48:34 +1000, "Ryadia_"
wrote:

Tell that to my customers Hecate.
Business printing from mobile phones has increased tenfold in the past 3 months and looks like overtaking prints from cameras. Get the blinkers

off

man!

I’m not a man. Perhaps that’s why I look for solutions instead of whining about why I can’t do this or the other.

As for printing from mobiles – no doubt it’s a useful little niche business which will probably last as long as it takes for the customer to realise that for pictures of that quality they can do it far more cheaply at home.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

Good lord, that’s the answer then.
just give up!
Unless you actually print them, how would you know what quality can be achieved from a camera phone image? As I recall, you are one of zealots who thinks you can’t interpolate images to get larger prints and have any quality. I guess not being a male, everything you’ve never done is quite clear to you.

Ryadia

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 03:30:26 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

Sorry, but mobile phones don’t cut it as cameras. And never will as they will never provide the same control as an SLR/lens system, digital or otherwise.

A good photographer can use a mobile phone to take a good picture.

Maybe. But the question really is, why would a *good* photographer want to so? Come on, do you take a mobile out with you to shoot? Even as a pocket camera? I certainly don’t, and wouldn’t. Even the more basic digital cameras which are pocketable produce far better images and give you more control. Mobiles are fine for the "Oooh, look ma, see what I got up to at the party" type pictures, but for anything else – you may as well buy a disposable – they’d give you a better picture.

There you go again. Passing judgment without the faintest clue about the subject.

Ryadia

Hecate wrote in
news::

Well, how many times in 120 days do you change your system substantially? I.e. add a new hard disk, more memory, hardware changes like that? (If you want a full list go to the MS site).

Depends if its a simple swap or running diagnostics to find a problem. I agree for most people it wouldnt be a problem. But for others it could. As a compromise I thought the pro version of XP didnt need activation, and people concerned about it could go that route. But I thought wrong.

"Ryadia_" wrote in message

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 03:30:26 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

Sorry, but mobile phones don’t cut it as cameras. And never will as they will never provide the same control as an SLR/lens system, digital or otherwise.

A good photographer can use a mobile phone to take a good picture.

Maybe. But the question really is, why would a *good* photographer want to so? Come on, do you take a mobile out with you to shoot? Even as a pocket camera? I certainly don’t, and wouldn’t. Even the more basic digital cameras which are pocketable produce far better images and give you more control. Mobiles are fine for the "Oooh, look ma, see what I got up to at the party" type pictures, but for anything else – you may as well buy a disposable – they’d give you a better picture.

There you go again. Passing judgment without the faintest clue about the subject.

If you had been here longer you’d know Hecate has a clue. And not only on the photography subject.

Stephan

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 03:30:26 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

Sorry, but mobile phones don’t cut it as cameras. And never will as they will never provide the same control as an SLR/lens system, digital or otherwise.

A good photographer can use a mobile phone to take a good picture.

Maybe. But the question really is, why would a *good* photographer want to so? Come on, do you take a mobile out with you to shoot? Even as a pocket camera? I certainly don’t, and wouldn’t. Even the more basic digital cameras which are pocketable produce far better images and give you more control. Mobiles are fine for the "Oooh, look ma, see what I got up to at the party" type pictures, but for anything else – you may as well buy a disposable – they’d give you a better picture.

—

I don’t have a mobile taking pics but as soon as they hit the 4 MP mark I’ll get one.
I don’t think I ‘ll take as only camera when I go working though 😉 Now the question is , ah the question, what is a good picture?

Stephan

Articus Drools wrote:

hmmm – I read this with interest

Keep posting all

Articus

Oh my God…
Now I’ve woken the beast. Help, let me out of here!

Ryadia

"Ryadia_" wrote:

Unless you actually print them, how would you know what quality can be achieved from a camera phone image?

🙂 … throw out some specs and we will tell you.

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

"Stephan" wrote:

Now the question is , ah the question, what is a good picture?

Any picture with kittens in it? 🙂

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

On 2004-09-16, Ryadia wrote:

Articus Drools wrote:

hmmm – I read this with interest

Keep posting all

Articus

Oh my God…
Now I’ve woken the beast. Help, let me out of here!

Ryadia

Actually, I found that adobe uses the boot mbr record to store computer info for activation quite interesting & informative. Various versions of ms windows have changed/altered the boot mbr rec with their "service packs".

There were a few claims that xp no longer recreate the boot mbr rec with the service pack….but I still don’t trust ms not to do something like that to the people having a dual boot system with linux.

Thanks for the info! Having the computer setup in the mbr boot rec will definitely be a problem with people, especially people using grub or lilo in the mbr boot rec for booting multiple operating systems.

me? ‘Ow?

Articus

"Ryadia" wrote in message

Articus Drools wrote:

hmmm – I read this with interest

Keep posting all

Articus

Oh my God…
Now I’ve woken the beast. Help, let me out of here!

Ryadia

"The Doormouse" wrote in message

"Stephan" wrote:

Now the question is , ah the question, what is a good picture?

Any picture with kittens in it? 🙂

Only if it is used to illustrate a recipe book.
(kitten tartar, yum)

Stephan

Samsung are about to release one this month.
I can only speculate about the optics. Poor at best but who’s to know? Samsung have pulled a few rabbits out of the hat in the past, maybe this is one?

Hey, could you just see Heacte trying to plug in her disposable camera to make some prints? Ha, ha. 😉

Ryadia
————-

—

I don’t have a mobile taking pics but as soon as they hit the 4 MP mark

I’ll

get one.
I don’t think I ‘ll take as only camera when I go working though 😉 Now the question is , ah the question, what is a good picture?
Stephan

After the last re-activation message, I removed the hard drive from the PC to have it examined by an expert. They are data recovery specialists and really know their drives. They said there is no Adobe code in MBR of that drive.

Odd because a reputable Technician who services no only my computers but those of a lot of graphic artists, told me that was where the code that told a reinstall of PS to activate immediately, was stored. Either the data got removed by a program (or Windows) or it doesn’t get stored there in the first place.Or, the data missing is what triggers reactivation.

Since then I downloaded an activation crack called "Paradox" which got the program working by replacing 3 files in the Adobe directory. Unfortunately this also disabled all the keyboard shortcuts too! So I still had to call Adobe for a set of numbers anyway.

When I get further into the situation, I recall another program I had on the same PC called NTI (a CD/DVD) recorder which every so often came up with a message about missing data and it had to be re-installed too. The NTI support line is just as bad (worse?) as Adobe’s and I ended up ditching the program. They ran me around about a refund and I never got one but that’s another story.

This all resulted in a close look at everything to do with that particular PC. I have a "monitoring" application called "Fixit Utilities" version 5. This was originally put out by Ontrack, the people who provide Seagate and WD with their drive controller software so you’d think it would be pretty good at looking after a WD drive, eh?

Well… Another flock called Vcom bought the program and this version is where the problem lies. It takes a "snapshot" of your drive and uses it for reference during it’s black magic. I don’t know exactly how or what this does but it is similar to Nortons – problematical.

The Trend anti-virus which comes with this package could be giving grief too. Who would know? None of these firms answer their e-mail and there is no Australian telephone number published. Is the software industry all run by robots? Anyway, installing a new PC with just Windows 2k and my card readers is working for the moment. This whole bloody episode has cost me nearly $2000. I’ve had to buy yet another Windows license and the Doormouse asks why I’ve got it in for Adobe?

Ryadia

wrote in message

On 2004-09-16, Ryadia wrote:

Articus Drools wrote:

hmmm – I read this with interest

Keep posting all

Articus

Oh my God…
Now I’ve woken the beast. Help, let me out of here!

Ryadia

Actually, I found that adobe uses the boot mbr record to store computer info for activation quite interesting & informative. Various versions of ms windows have changed/altered the boot mbr rec with their "service packs".

There were a few claims that xp no longer recreate the boot mbr rec with the service pack….but I still don’t trust ms not to do something like that to the people having a dual boot system with linux.
Thanks for the info! Having the computer setup in the mbr boot rec will definitely be a problem with people, especially people using grub or lilo in the mbr boot rec for booting multiple operating systems.

"Stephan" wrote:

Only if it is used to illustrate a recipe book.
(kitten tartar, yum)

If kitten meat was any good, we would already be eating them. Did you ever see the boxed kittens website?

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

"Ryadia_" wrote:

This whole bloody episode has cost me
nearly $2000. I’ve had to buy yet another Windows license and the Doormouse asks why I’ve got it in for Adobe?

Wow. I guess that stupidity DOES have a price tag.

The Doormouse

—
The Doormouse cannot be reached by e-mail without her permission.

On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 03:14:54 -0000, Theo wrote:

Hecate wrote in
news::

Well, how many times in 120 days do you change your system substantially? I.e. add a new hard disk, more memory, hardware changes like that? (If you want a full list go to the MS site).

Depends if its a simple swap or running diagnostics to find a problem. I agree for most people it wouldnt be a problem. But for others it could. As a compromise I thought the pro version of XP didnt need activation, and people concerned about it could go that route. But I thought wrong.

It doesn’t if you buy through the licensing program, but you need have a minimum number of licenses.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 13:09:06 +1000, "Ryadia_"
wrote:

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 11:48:34 +1000, "Ryadia_"
wrote:

Tell that to my customers Hecate.
Business printing from mobile phones has increased tenfold in the past 3 months and looks like overtaking prints from cameras. Get the blinkers

off

man!

I’m not a man. Perhaps that’s why I look for solutions instead of whining about why I can’t do this or the other.

As for printing from mobiles – no doubt it’s a useful little niche business which will probably last as long as it takes for the customer to realise that for pictures of that quality they can do it far more cheaply at home.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

Good lord, that’s the answer then.
just give up!
Unless you actually print them, how would you know what quality can be achieved from a camera phone image?

I know what size the image is in pixels. I can find out (and have for a couple of phones) what size the sensor is. I know how to extrapolate. Next question..

As I recall, you are one of zealots who
thinks you can’t interpolate images to get larger prints and have any quality. I guess not being a male, everything you’ve never done is quite clear to you.

You can interpolate however much you want – what you can’t do is insert data where none exists.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 13:10:50 +1000, "Ryadia_"
wrote:

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 03:30:26 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

Sorry, but mobile phones don’t cut it as cameras. And never will as they will never provide the same control as an SLR/lens system, digital or otherwise.

A good photographer can use a mobile phone to take a good picture.

Maybe. But the question really is, why would a *good* photographer want to so? Come on, do you take a mobile out with you to shoot? Even as a pocket camera? I certainly don’t, and wouldn’t. Even the more basic digital cameras which are pocketable produce far better images and give you more control. Mobiles are fine for the "Oooh, look ma, see what I got up to at the party" type pictures, but for anything else – you may as well buy a disposable – they’d give you a better picture.

There you go again. Passing judgment without the faintest clue about the subject.

Ah, so you think mobile phone cameras are wonderful devices and nobody needs SLRs, medium format, or even 5MP point and shoot digital cameras anymore?

Grow up. Mobile phone cameras are ideal for people who haven’t a clue about photography and want some happy snaps to show to their friends. Nothing else. And trying to claim otherwise just shows that you have no clue about photography.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 04:22:52 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 03:30:26 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

Sorry, but mobile phones don’t cut it as cameras. And never will as they will never provide the same control as an SLR/lens system, digital or otherwise.

A good photographer can use a mobile phone to take a good picture.

Maybe. But the question really is, why would a *good* photographer want to so? Come on, do you take a mobile out with you to shoot? Even as a pocket camera? I certainly don’t, and wouldn’t. Even the more basic digital cameras which are pocketable produce far better images and give you more control. Mobiles are fine for the "Oooh, look ma, see what I got up to at the party" type pictures, but for anything else – you may as well buy a disposable – they’d give you a better picture.

—

I don’t have a mobile taking pics but as soon as they hit the 4 MP mark I’ll get one.
I don’t think I ‘ll take as only camera when I go working though 😉 Now the question is , ah the question, what is a good picture?

LOL!

I won’t bother because by the time mobiles have 4MP you’ll be able to buy a point-and-shoot with 16MP 😉

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 12:45:47 GMT, The Doormouse
wrote:

"Stephan" wrote:

Now the question is , ah the question, what is a good picture?

Any picture with kittens in it? 🙂

No, not cats. Bunnies 🙂

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 18:42:48 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

"The Doormouse" wrote in message

"Stephan" wrote:

Now the question is , ah the question, what is a good picture?

Any picture with kittens in it? 🙂

Only if it is used to illustrate a recipe book.
(kitten tartar, yum)

Frogs legs? 😉

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 06:53:09 +1000, "Ryadia_"
wrote:

Samsung are about to release one this month.
I can only speculate about the optics. Poor at best but who’s to know? Samsung have pulled a few rabbits out of the hat in the past, maybe this is one?

Hey, could you just see Heacte trying to plug in her disposable camera to make some prints? Ha, ha. 😉

You don’t have a clue do you? It’s easy to tell – at the first sign of anyone disagreeing with you you move on to personal insults. A sure sign of a someone with a lack of evidence for their arguments and an IQ somewhat smaller than their shoe size.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

The Doormouse wrote:

"Ryadia_" wrote:

This whole bloody episode has cost me
nearly $2000. I’ve had to buy yet another Windows license and the Doormouse asks why I’ve got it in for Adobe?

Wow. I guess that stupidity DOES have a price tag.

The Doormouse

Well the thread is about stupidity 😉

Ryadia

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 18:42:48 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

"The Doormouse" wrote in message

"Stephan" wrote:

Now the question is , ah the question, what is a good picture?

Any picture with kittens in it? 🙂

Only if it is used to illustrate a recipe book.
(kitten tartar, yum)

Frogs legs? 😉

Better than fish n’ chips!

Stephan

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 12:45:47 GMT, The Doormouse
wrote:

"Stephan" wrote:

Now the question is , ah the question, what is a good picture?

Any picture with kittens in it? 🙂

No, not cats. Bunnies 🙂

And sunsets, sunsets photos are always good photos, aren’t they?

Stephan

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 04:22:52 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

picture.

—

I don’t have a mobile taking pics but as soon as they hit the 4 MP mark

I’ll

get one.
I don’t think I ‘ll take as only camera when I go working though 😉 Now the question is , ah the question, what is a good picture?

LOL!

I won’t bother because by the time mobiles have 4MP you’ll be able to buy a point-and-shoot with 16MP 😉

I am trying to find this article I read a couple of days ago about new, very small and incredibly good lenses.
Lost it…
Things change fast, I remember when "digital" meant not serious. I tell you what, you buy me a 4MP telephone and I’ll send you nice photos taken with it, if you don’t find them good I’ll send you the phone back. Deal?
16 MP is not for me, I rarely print big and if I needed to I know how to stitch now.

Stephan

"Hecate" wrote in message

You can interpolate however much you want – what you can’t do is insert data where none exists.

—

This is precisely what interpolation does. And despite your blinkerd attitude, is done every day by digital print labs all over the world. How do you think Canon 10D owners get poster prints from their 10"x 6.5 ", 300 dpi camera files? Use crayons, perhaps?

Ryadia

Ryadia_ wrote:

"Hecate" wrote in message

You can interpolate however much you want – what you can’t do is insert data where none exists.

—

This is precisely what interpolation does. And despite your blinkerd attitude, is done every day by digital print labs all over the world. How do you think Canon 10D owners get poster prints from their 10"x 6.5 ", 300 dpi camera files? Use crayons, perhaps?

There are some relatively expensive programs which will allow someone to interpolate up to a large size much more attractively than a program like Photoshop. Genuine Fractals is probably the best known.

I don’t know how Canon 10D owners get poster prints but it could be that 150 dpi (or less) is enough to print as well as they need and they can get a size boost through reducing the resolution but locking the file size. It’s also possible that they use software like Genuine Fractals to help make those posters.

I think the disagreement here is a symantic one. I think what Hecate meant is you can’t insert data with detail where it doesn’t exist whereas you seem to simply mean adding more data period and ballooning file size. You can add in data in that manner. You just can’t add detail through interpolating to a bigger size or what some would consider "aesthetically improving data". The best you can hope for is to not make it any less detailed or worse looking and what you can reasonably expect is that it will be worse and lose detail.

Orchid

Orchid wrote:

I think the disagreement here is a symantic one.

That should be "semantic". Please pardon the awkward typo.

Orchid

"Orchid" wrote in message

I don’t know how Canon 10D owners get poster prints but it could be that 150 dpi (or less) is enough to print as well as they need and they can get a size boost through reducing the resolution but locking the file size. It’s also possible that they use software like Genuine Fractals to help make those posters.

Orchid

150 DPI is not enough for a continuous tone printer such as Durst’s Lambda, lasers.
I frequently enlarge digital images to 1200% their original size before any noticeable loss of detail occurs. Even at 2000% – due to the size of the print – by using a viewing distance of 4 or 5 feet, prints from good quality digital cameras using high quality optics look amazingly sharp.

Even the relatively cheap ($25 US) action Fred Miranda puts out for Photoshop to interpolate in 10% increments will triple the size of an image and show little or no loss of detail although the bicubic method he uses does lose some detail.

180 DPI is OK for ink prints although 200 DPI is better. Even so… Nearly all the inkjet printer drivers interpolate images up and down in the printing process to be able to print a 200 DPI file to a 2800 DPI print head.

Ryadia

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 19:06:04 +1000, "Ryadia_"
wrote:

"Hecate" wrote in message

You can interpolate however much you want – what you can’t do is insert data where none exists.

—

This is precisely what interpolation does. And despite your blinkerd attitude, is done every day by digital print labs all over the world. How do you think Canon 10D owners get poster prints from their 10"x 6.5 ", 300 dpi camera files? Use crayons, perhaps?

DPI is variable depending upon the size of the image due to the distance at which the image is viewed. I.e. you don’t require 300dpi for e.g. an A2 image. Of course, I’m not surprised you don’t know that as you’ve spent a lot of time and energy showing everyone how much you don’t know.

The second thing you obviously don’t understand 9is that interpolation is not inserting data where none exists – it’s inserting it’s best "guess" of what should be there. That isn’t inserting data it’s guesswork. Some software is better at guessing that others, but it’s still not inserting real data. It can’t. Again, your lack of understanding is impressive. If you want good example, try inserting the data underneath some water that hasn’t had the benefit of a polarizer.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 05:56:09 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

Frogs legs? 😉

Better than fish n’ chips!

They taste like chicken 🙂

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 05:57:34 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 12:45:47 GMT, The Doormouse
wrote:

"Stephan" wrote:

Now the question is , ah the question, what is a good picture?

Any picture with kittens in it? 🙂

No, not cats. Bunnies 🙂

And sunsets, sunsets photos are always good photos, aren’t they?

LOL!

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 06:04:47 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

I won’t bother because by the time mobiles have 4MP you’ll be able to buy a point-and-shoot with 16MP 😉

I am trying to find this article I read a couple of days ago about new, very small and incredibly good lenses.
Lost it…
Things change fast, I remember when "digital" meant not serious. I tell you what, you buy me a 4MP telephone and I’ll send you nice photos taken with it, if you don’t find them good I’ll send you the phone back. Deal?
16 MP is not for me, I rarely print big and if I needed to I know how to stitch now.

<g> Things improve, they always do. But I’m not convinced that the marriage between phones and cameras will last any great length of time.

—

Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

Hecate wrote:

<g> Things improve, they always do. But I’m not convinced that the marriage between phones and cameras will last any great length of time.

Yes, it’s phoney.
—

Mike Russell
www.curvemeister.com
www.geigy.2y.net

ah – an excellent response

(i wish i had thought about it)

Artie

"Mike Russell" wrote in message

Hecate wrote:

<g> Things improve, they always do. But I’m not convinced that the marriage between phones and cameras will last any great length of time.

Yes, it’s phoney.
—

Mike Russell
www.curvemeister.com
www.geigy.2y.net

"Hecate" wrote in message

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 05:56:09 GMT, "Stephan"
wrote:

Frogs legs? 😉

Better than fish n’ chips!

They taste like chicken 🙂

They do!
Stephan