Color Space of P.S. CS – sRGB and Monitor RGB?

Sounds like Acdsee and Breezebrowswer is ignoring the colourspace information and using default colourspace.

Either: convert the image to the default colour space, or make sure your recipients are using a image viewer that takes colourspace into consideration to ensure the image is being displayed correctly.

"Stanley" wrote in message

Hi all,

I’m using photoshop CS to read and process my raw photos from a canon 20D camera. I got some problems about the color space.

My CS’s color space is set to "sRGB-IEC61966-2.1". And there is no color management (monitor profile) in my system setting. (I’m using a Sony laptop with a LCD monitor)

I opened these raw files by CS,resized and converted them into jpg files.
Color of these jpg files looks lighter when I browsed them by Acdsee and Breezebrowser. But them look just like photoshop ones if I opened them by "windows picture and fax viewer". These files are set to RGB mode and no gamma correction feature is actived in Acdsee.
If I set photoshop to "Monitor RGB – sRGB-IEC61966-2.1", and opened these jpg files again. The color is the same Acdsee and
Breezebrowswer.

Here comes the question, why these 2 "sRGB" colors are different? and which one is more accurate, relatively? (I perfer richer colors of sRGB space "north america general purpose default")
I just want to make sure the people can see similiar(I know it’s too far away from "same") colors as I see.

Thanks for your help. 🙂

Stanly C.

Stanley wrote:

My CS’s color space is set to "sRGB-IEC61966-2.1". And there is no color management (monitor profile) in my system setting. (I’m using a Sony laptop with a LCD monitor)

Hi Stanley, since you do not have (an accurate) display profile in the DisplayProperties… Colormanagement -tab your system assume that your display is in the sadRGB color-space. No displays are in that color-space, especially so with flat panels since flat panels can not be profiled with any kind of RGB working-space ICC proflies. With flat panels you need a very accurate display profile.

Color of these jpg files looks lighter when I browsed them by Acdsee and Breezebrowser. But them look just like photoshop ones if I opened them by "windows picture and fax viewer". These files are set to RGB mode and no gamma correction feature is actived in Acdsee.
If I set photoshop to "Monitor RGB – sRGB-IEC61966-2.1", and opened these jpg files again. The color is the same Acdsee and
Breezebrowswer.

Here comes the question, why these 2 "sRGB" colors are different? and which one is more accurate, relatively?

Aha. There should be no difference at all. The color-management is active but the system is specified to be in the sadRGB and your RGB working-space inside Photoshop is also sadRGB. No conversion should happen and in fact does not happen.

However, the Adobe color-management engine (AdobeACE) does apply slope-limiting on the display path over the dark end of tonal reproduction range. This is why in your system the image appearance is more dark in Photoshop.

When you set Photoshop color-management to "Monitor RGB" then in effect the color-management inside Photoshop is disabled so also the slope-limiting is disabled. And you get the very same image appearance that you get in other software that are not color-managed.

With properly profiled display this particular slope-limiting on the display path of Photoshop gives trouble only with dark (low-key) images.

(I perfer richer colors of sRGB space "north america general purpose default")

There are no "richer colors of sadRGB space". Colors are what they are and the task of color-manamement is to keep them like that.

When one Assign say AdobeRGB profile to the JPEGs that one get from the RAW converter while the conversion option was say sadRGB then of course colors do appear with far less saturation but this is because the color-management was not used correctly.

I just want to make sure the people can see similiar
(I know it’s too far away from "same") colors as I see.

You need a _very_ good profile for your LCD panel and still you will not get very good accuracy. Much better solution is to hook up a CRT monitor to your laptop that is then calibrated&profiled with the AdobeGamma. Flat panels are very difficult for color-management, their properties vary enormously from model to model and they are extremely difficult to profile acccurately.
Timo Autiokari http://www.aim-dtp.net

Stanley,

I forgot to mention, most if not all the laptops have the normal CRT socket …and it is quite easy to find a CRT for comparison experiment. I warmly suggest to you such an expereiment, it is very useful to see this side by side.

wrote:
Stanley wrote:

My CS’s color space is set to "sRGB-IEC61966-2.1". And there is no color management (monitor profile) in my system setting. (I’m using a Sony laptop with a LCD monitor)

Hi Stanley, since you do not have (an accurate) display profile in the DisplayProperties… Colormanagement -tab your system assume that your display is in the sadRGB color-space. No displays are in that color-space, especially so with flat panels since flat panels can not be profiled with any kind of RGB working-space ICC proflies. With flat panels you need a very accurate display profile.

Color of these jpg files looks lighter when I browsed them by Acdsee and Breezebrowser. But them look just like photoshop ones if I opened them by "windows picture and fax viewer". These files are set to RGB mode and no gamma correction feature is actived in Acdsee.
If I set photoshop to "Monitor RGB – sRGB-IEC61966-2.1", and opened these jpg files again. The color is the same Acdsee and
Breezebrowswer.

Here comes the question, why these 2 "sRGB" colors are different? and which one is more accurate, relatively?

Aha. There should be no difference at all. The color-management is active but the system is specified to be in the sadRGB and your RGB working-space inside Photoshop is also sadRGB. No conversion should happen and in fact does not happen.

However, the Adobe color-management engine (AdobeACE) does apply slope-limiting on the display path over the dark end of tonal reproduction range. This is why in your system the image appearance is more dark in Photoshop.

When you set Photoshop color-management to "Monitor RGB" then in effect the color-management inside Photoshop is disabled so also the slope-limiting is disabled. And you get the very same image appearance that you get in other software that are not color-managed.

With properly profiled display this particular slope-limiting on the display path of Photoshop gives trouble only with dark (low-key) images.

(I perfer richer colors of sRGB space "north america general purpose default")

There are no "richer colors of sadRGB space". Colors are what they are and the task of color-manamement is to keep them like that.

When one Assign say AdobeRGB profile to the JPEGs that one get from the RAW converter while the conversion option was say sadRGB then of course colors do appear with far less saturation but this is because the color-management was not used correctly.

I just want to make sure the people can see similiar
(I know it’s too far away from "same") colors as I see.

You need a _very_ good profile for your LCD panel and still you will not get very good accuracy. Much better solution is to hook up a CRT monitor to your laptop that is then calibrated&profiled with the AdobeGamma. Flat panels are very difficult for color-management, their properties vary enormously from model to model and they are extremely difficult to profile acccurately.

Timo Autiokari http://www.aim-dtp.net

why go to all the trouble with RAW if your gonna ruin the picture anyway by converting it to jpeg, Tiff would be a better option

http://community.webtv.net/TinyJohnsonnnnn/MyComputer
http://community.webtv.net/TinyJohnsonnnn/recentpics

Timo Autiokari wrote in
news::

Stanley,

I forgot to mention, most if not all the laptops have the normal CRT socket …and it is quite easy to find a CRT for comparison experiment. I warmly suggest to you such an expereiment, it is very useful to see this side by side.

wrote:
Stanley wrote:

My CS’s color space is set to "sRGB-IEC61966-2.1". And there is no color management (monitor profile) in my system setting. (I’m using a Sony laptop with a LCD monitor)

Hi Stanley, since you do not have (an accurate) display profile in the DisplayProperties… Colormanagement -tab your system assume that your display is in the sadRGB color-space. No displays are in that color-space, especially so with flat panels since flat panels can not be profiled with any kind of RGB working-space ICC proflies. With flat panels you need a very accurate display profile.

Color of these jpg files looks lighter when I browsed them by Acdsee and Breezebrowser. But them look just like photoshop ones if I opened them by "windows picture and fax viewer". These files are set to RGB mode and no gamma correction feature is actived in Acdsee.
If I set photoshop to "Monitor RGB – sRGB-IEC61966-2.1", and opened these jpg files again. The color is the same Acdsee and
Breezebrowswer.

Here comes the question, why these 2 "sRGB" colors are different? and which one is more accurate, relatively?

Aha. There should be no difference at all. The color-management is active but the system is specified to be in the sadRGB and your RGB working-space inside Photoshop is also sadRGB. No conversion should happen and in fact does not happen.

However, the Adobe color-management engine (AdobeACE) does apply slope-limiting on the display path over the dark end of tonal reproduction range. This is why in your system the image appearance is more dark in Photoshop.

When you set Photoshop color-management to "Monitor RGB" then in effect the color-management inside Photoshop is disabled so also the slope-limiting is disabled. And you get the very same image appearance that you get in other software that are not color-managed.
With properly profiled display this particular slope-limiting on the display path of Photoshop gives trouble only with dark (low-key) images.

(I perfer richer colors of sRGB space "north america general purpose default")

There are no "richer colors of sadRGB space". Colors are what they are and the task of color-manamement is to keep them like that.
When one Assign say AdobeRGB profile to the JPEGs that one get from the RAW converter while the conversion option was say sadRGB then of course colors do appear with far less saturation but this is because the color-management was not used correctly.

I just want to make sure the people can see similiar
(I know it’s too far away from "same") colors as I see.

You need a _very_ good profile for your LCD panel and still you will not get very good accuracy. Much better solution is to hook up a CRT monitor to your laptop that is then calibrated&profiled with the AdobeGamma. Flat panels are very difficult for color-management, their properties vary enormously from model to model and they are extremely difficult to profile acccurately.

Timo Autiokari http://www.aim-dtp.net

YAY!!!
i’ve been having trouble with reds and other colors for a long time. but i just read this and went in:

Edit/Color Setting –> "Setting" –> (selected) –> "Color Management Off"

now i see the colors the way i expect 😀 and the way they look to everyone who sees my photos.
THANX!!!