Newest Photography Craze: HDR Training

X
Posted By
xTrainGuru
Mar 15, 2008
Views
1668
Replies
26
Status
Closed
Prepare yourself for the best photograph ever!

http://www.xtrain.com/Ben

Don’t be caught with a DSLR without learning how to take "As your eye really sees the world" photography called HDR. You see HDR is the processing of multiple exposures to create a surreal, but real images. No more sky blown out, or shadows too dark.

Ben Willmore gives you the insides information of how to shoot HDR, how to merge photos in Photoshop and Photomatix. You will learn the key to successful HDR photographs.

The first step to learn more about Ben and his expert classes at http://www.xtrain.com/Ben

Get Started, it’s Fun & Affordable!
Siotha Vest
Director of Training
www.xtrain.com
siotha.wordpress.com

Master Retouching Hair

Learn how to rescue details, remove flyaways, add volume, and enhance the definition of hair in any photo. We break down every tool and technique in Photoshop to get picture-perfect hair, every time.

D
Dave
Mar 16, 2008
The neccesary step to learn more about DSLR

is to type ‘Free Tutorials’ on your search machine.
J
John
Mar 17, 2008
On Sat, 15 Mar 2008 16:40:00 -0700 (PDT), "xTrain Design & Marketing" wrote:

No more sky blown out, or shadows too dark.

It’s called the Zone System. You should try it with a real camera.

JD
K
KatWoman
Mar 17, 2008
"John" wrote in message
On Sat, 15 Mar 2008 16:40:00 -0700 (PDT), "xTrain Design & Marketing" wrote:

No more sky blown out, or shadows too dark.

It’s called the Zone System. You should try it with a real camera.
JD

LOL

OK ANSEL
J
John
Mar 17, 2008
On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 16:52:58 -0400, "KatWoman" wrote:

It’s called the Zone System. You should try it with a real camera.
JD

LOL

OK ANSEL

Me and my 5X7 Linhof thank you very much however I’m closer to being someone in the shadow of Ansel. Boy would he have had a ball my Panasonic 10MP though !

JD

"To photograph truthfully and effectively is to see beneath the surfaces and record the qualities of nature and humanity which live or are latent in all things." – Ansel Adams (1902-1984)
G
granny
Mar 18, 2008
"John" wrote in message
On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 16:52:58 -0400, "KatWoman" wrote:

It’s called the Zone System. You should try it with a real camera.
JD

LOL

OK ANSEL

Me and my 5X7 Linhof thank you very much however I’m closer to being someone in the shadow of Ansel. Boy would he have had a ball my Panasonic 10MP though !

JD

"To photograph truthfully and effectively is to see beneath the surfaces and record the qualities of nature and humanity which live or are latent in all things." – Ansel Adams (1902-1984

Could you explain please what this new ‘Zone System’ is with step by step instructions… I want to see below surface like x-ray

Thank you in advance

J
jjs
Mar 18, 2008
"granny" wrote in message

Could you explain please what this new ‘Zone System’ is with step by step instructions…

Sure, just as soon as you post step-by-step instructions for brain surgery
J
John
Mar 18, 2008
On Tue, 18 Mar 2008 01:43:39 -0500, "granny"
wrote:

Could you explain please what this new ‘Zone System’ is with step by step instructions… I want to see below surface like x-ray
Thank you in advance

You will find a good overview at the following links :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zone_system

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/zone_system.shtm l

http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/zone.htm

As to X-Ray vision, I don’t have any experience in that field. Now infrared is quite interesting.

http://www.dimagemaker.com/article.php?articleID=789

One might be able to use a Kodak Aero-Ektar with some HSI (if you can find it) for interesting images.

JD
G
granny
Mar 18, 2008
<jjs> wrote in message
"granny" wrote in message

Could you explain please what this new ‘Zone System’ is with step by step instructions…

Sure, just as soon as you post step-by-step instructions for brain surgery

APPARATUS AND METHODS FOR PERFORMING BRAIN SURGERY

A less invasive surgical technique for performing brain surgery in which a dilating obturator and cannula assembly is inserted into brain tissue until the obturator tip and cannula are adjacent the target tissue. The obturator is removed and surgery is performed through the cannula. In preferred embodiments the obturator and cannula are placed using image guidance techniques and systems to coordinate placement with pre-operative surgical planning. A stylet with associated image guidance may be inserted prior to insertion of the obturator and cannula assembly to guide insertion of the obturator and cannula assembly. Surgery preferable is performed using an endoscope partially inserted into the cannula with an image of the target tissue projected onto a monitor.

The brain is a delicate soft tissue structure that controls bodily functions through a complex neural network connected to the rest of the body through the spinal cord. The brain and spinal cord are contained within and protected by significant bony structures, e.g., the skull and the spine. Given the difficulty of accessing the brain through the hard bony protective skull the diagnosis and treatment of brain disorders presents unique challenges not encountered elsewhere in the body. Diagnosis of brain disorders requires clear, accurate imaging of brain tissue through the skull. In recent years significant advances have been made in imaging technology, including stereotactic X-ray imaging, Computerized Axial Tomography (CAT), Position Emission Tomography (PET) and Magnetic Resonance Imaging (MRI). See, for example, Butler U.S. Patent 6,359,959. These imaging devices and techniques permit the surgeon to examine conditions within the brain in a non-invasive manner without opening the skull. If a target lesion or mass is identified through use of one or more imaging techniques, it may be necessary or desirable to biopsy a lesion within the brain.

Once a diagnosis has been reached based upon one or more imaging techniques, a treatment plan must be developed. One available method of treatment involves X-ray therapy

Alternatively, surgical treatment may be necessary or desired. In order to operate surgically on the brain, access must be obtained through the skull and delicate brain tissue containing blood vessels and nerves that can be adversely affected by slight disturbances. Therefore, great care must be taken in operating on the brain not to disturb delicate blood vessels and nerves so that adverse consequences do not resxilt during or after surgery. Brain surgery can be highly invasive. In some instances, in order to obtain access to target tissue, a substantial portion of the skull is removed and entire sections of the brain are retracted to obtain access. Of course, such techniques are not appropriate for all situations, and not all patients are able to tolerate and recover from such invasive techniques. It is also known to access certain portions of the brain by forming a hole in the skull, but only limited surgical techniques may be performed through such smaller openings. In addition, some techniques have been developed to enter through the nasal passages, opening an access hole through the occipital bone to remove tumors located, for example, in the area of the pituitary.

A significant advance in brain surgery is stereotactic surgery involving a stereotactic frame correlated to stereotactic X-ray images to guide a probe or other smrgical instrument through an opening formed in the skull through brain tissue to a target lesion or other body.

A related advance is frameless image guidance, in which an image of the surgical instrument is superimposed on a pre-operative image to demonstrate the location of the instrument to the surgeon and trajectory of further movement of the probe or instrument.

A preferred apparatus for accessing brain tissue has a dilating obturator with a blunt distal tip, a substantially cylindrical shaft portion, and a proximal handle portion. A cannula is disposed around the shaft portion and preferably is made of a transparent material. The obturator and cannula assembly preferably is associated with an image-guided surgery system so that placement of the obturator and cannula assembly can be carefully monitored and controlled as the obturator and cannula assembly is atraumatically inserted into brain tissue.

In a first embodiment the obturator has a longitudinal channel therethrough configured and dimensioned to receive the shaft of a narrow stylet or probe. The stylet or probe has attached thereto image guidance means calibrated to indicate the orientation and position of the stylet or probe. An image guidance system interacts with the stylet or probe to display for the surgeon on a monitor an image of the stylet or probe superimposed onto an image of the patient s brain, such as an MRI image. The image may be a pre-operative MRI image used for surgical planning. When the stylet or probe is mounted in the longitudinal channel of the obturator, the superimposed image of the probe also is indicative of the position and orientation of the dilating obturator and the cannula.

Traditional methods are used to incise and retract soft tissue of the scalp covering the skull. A hole is made in the skull, and the dura is opened and retracted to provide access to the brain. In the first method, the stylet or probe is inserted through the obturator longitudinal channel and advanced until a length of the stylet or probe extends out of and beyond the blunt tip of the dilating obturator. The dilating obturator and cannula assembly is held back away from the tissue as the stylet or probe is gently advanced through the brain tissue under both direct vision and positional image guidance until the tip of the stylet or probe is adjacent the target tissue. Once the stylet or probe is placed and the position is confirmed using the image guidance system, the blunt dilating obturator and cannula assembly is slowly and carefully advanced into the brain tissue to atraumatically spread the tissue over the dilating tip and around the cannula while maintaining the position of the stylet or probe as a guide to advancement of the obturator and cannula assembly. A gentle back and forth rotation during insertion may facilitate placement of the obturator cannula assembly. Preferably, the cannula is clear so that the dilated brain tissue may be visually inspected through the walls of the cannula to assure that no damage was caused to surrounding brain tissue during insertion of the device.

Alternatively, in a second contemplated method the image guidance means may be mounted directly to the dilating obturator and cannula assembly so that the obturator and cannula assembly may be inserted without a separate stylet or probe. In this configuration, the obturator and cannula assembly is inserted into the brain tissue under image guidance until the obturator is adjacent the target tissue. Once the obturator and cannula assembly is positioned, the dilating obturator is removed, leaving the cannula in place.

In yet a third contemplated method, the dilating obturator and cannula assembly may be inserted into the brain under direct visualization without use of an image guidance system.

After the cannula is placed, surgery may be performed through the cannula, either under direct vision or more preferably using an endoscope and camera system to project an enlarged image of the target tissue onto a monitor to visualize the tissue during surgery.

Preferably, the cannula has a diameter of approximately 10 mm to 20 mm, and more preferably 10 mm to 15 mm. An endoscope of a substantially smaller diameter, such as a 4 mm endoscope, is mounted partially inserted into the cannula. The endoscope is mounted to one side of the cannula and inserted so that the image projected onto the monitor is of the target tissue at the end of the cannula. In practice, a 4 mm endoscope inserted approximately halfway into the cannula is appropriate to create the desired image display while leaving a substantial portion of the cannula open and available for the insertion of instruments to perform surgery. Optionally, a camera holder may be used to secure the endoscope in the desired position.

Appropriate surgical instruments are then used to perform surgery upon the target tissue. For example, scissors, graspers and suction tools may be inserted through the cannula, visualizing the tips of the instruments to perform the desired procedure either directly with the naked eye or through a microscope, or indirectly through the endoscope using the endoscope eyepiece or more preferably and camera system to display the image on a monitor. A preferred instrument for debulking brain tissue is a fluidized ultrasonic instrument, such as CUSA

During surgery, monitoring equipment may be used to monitor brain function during surgery to assist the surgeon in understanding the effects of the actions taken during surgery operating on the brain so that the surgery may be terminated in the event an indication of an adverse effect is detected.

After surgery upon, the target tissue is complete, the cannula is gently removed, and the dura, skull and scalp are closed in a traditional fashion.

Gentle atraumatic dilation of the brain tissue makes it possible to operate further inside the brain than otherwise would be possible utilizing traditional surgical techniques. The disclosed methods and apparatus create an access area to work while simultaneously protecting adjacent brain tissue from, inadvertent collateral damage and trauma that might otherwise occur if more traditional surgical techniques were to be utilized. In addition, accessing target tissue through the cannula as contemplated avoids more invasive techniques that involve removing substantial portions of the skull and retracting large portions of the brain to gain access to operate on target tissues. In some cases, the devices and methods may make it possible to operate on target tissue that would, without these devices and methods, otherwise be regarded as inoperable using previously known techniques.

The techniques described herein are particularly useful to access tumors, cysts or other conditions which might otherwise be considered inoperable or might require much more invasive transcranial surgery to remove a larger portion of the skull and retract a substantial amount of brain tissue. The techniques described herein using dilating obturator and cannula permit brain surgery to be performed in a less invasive manner through an opening in the skull that is substantially smaller then otherwise possible, on the order of a 2 cm to 4 cm in diameter rather than a much larger opening for more traditional surgical techniques.

TAG – U – R- IT – ! Your Turn!!
J
John
Mar 18, 2008
On Tue, 18 Mar 2008 08:51:32 -0500, "granny"
wrote:

<jjs> wrote in message
"granny" wrote in message

Could you explain please what this new ‘Zone System’ is with step by step instructions…

Sure, just as soon as you post step-by-step instructions for brain surgery

APPARATUS AND METHODS FOR PERFORMING BRAIN SURGERY

Well now ! You just never know what’s going to popup on the USENET !

JD
G
granny
Mar 18, 2008
"John" wrote in message
On Tue, 18 Mar 2008 01:43:39 -0500, "granny"
wrote:
Could you explain please what this new ‘Zone System’ is with step by step instructions… I want to see below surface like x-ray Thank you in advance

You will find a good overview at the following links :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zone_system
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/zone_system.shtm l http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/zone.htm
As to X-Ray vision, I don’t have any experience in that field. Now infrared is quite interesting.
http://www.dimagemaker.com/article.php?articleID=789
One might be able to use a Kodak Aero-Ektar with some HSI (if you can find it) for interesting images.
JD

John, You are good people!

The links are very informative and relevant to an idiotic question/request and an ill attempt at humor referencing your quote "to see beneath the
surfaces and record the qualities of nature and humanity which live or are latent in all things." by Ansel Adams.. Very few people now days have the time for "f/64" and rely on in camera "zone" lightmeters with shutters that only click when you show teeth

BTW.. I have used that huge lens mounted on my 4×5 but with regular film. (Dang, that was a few days ago! In the 50s) and I don’t think the mount would fit the Phonecam I have now..

Instead of all that.. I will settle for the Sony nightshot.. heck it can even see through clothes given the right conditions.. and all digitals can see IR (just need to remove the filter for optimum use)

Anyway.. Thanks for keeping the NG honest and appropriate (Tis rare in this day and age!)

I will keep it more relevant next time..

"Granny"
Old N Slow N Prefer Quick N Easy
G
granny
Mar 18, 2008
"John" wrote in message
On Tue, 18 Mar 2008 08:51:32 -0500, "granny"
wrote:

<jjs> wrote in message
"granny" wrote in message

Could you explain please what this new ‘Zone System’ is with step by
step instructions…

Sure, just as soon as you post step-by-step instructions for brain surgery

APPARATUS AND METHODS FOR PERFORMING BRAIN SURGERY

Well now ! You just never know what’s going to popup on the USENET !
JD

I’m just an Old Granny BUT, I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night!
K
KatWoman
Mar 18, 2008
"granny" wrote in message
"John" wrote in message
On Tue, 18 Mar 2008 01:43:39 -0500, "granny"
wrote:
Could you explain please what this new ‘Zone System’ is with step by step instructions… I want to see below surface like x-ray Thank you in advance

You will find a good overview at the following links :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zone_system
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/zone_system.shtm l http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/zone.htm
As to X-Ray vision, I don’t have any experience in that field. Now infrared is quite interesting.
http://www.dimagemaker.com/article.php?articleID=789
One might be able to use a Kodak Aero-Ektar with some HSI (if you can find it) for interesting images.
JD

John, You are good people!

The links are very informative and relevant to an idiotic question/request and an ill attempt at humor referencing your quote "to see beneath the surfaces and record the qualities of nature and humanity which live or are latent in all things." by Ansel Adams.. Very few people now days have the time for "f/64" and rely on in camera "zone" lightmeters with shutters that only click when you show teeth

BTW.. I have used that huge lens mounted on my 4×5 but with regular film. (Dang, that was a few days ago! In the 50s) and I don’t think the mount would fit the Phonecam I have now..

Instead of all that.. I will settle for the Sony nightshot.. heck it can even see through clothes given the right conditions.. and all digitals can see IR (just need to remove the filter for optimum use)

Anyway.. Thanks for keeping the NG honest and appropriate (Tis rare in this day and age!)

I will keep it more relevant next time..

"Granny"
Old N Slow N Prefer Quick N Easy

granny ZONE SYSTEM is ancient history in photography
just the shortest version here: Ansel recommended a lot of different zones each with varying exposures
to bring out maximum tonality in specific areas of BW images he was also famous for making endless prints before being satisfied

while I would never criticize his work for most of us it is a very tedious method of capture
and really applies to artsy fartsy landscape images he produced

My husband apprenticed under a guy who was his contemporary and he had endless funny things to say about ANSEL
among my favorites was he was a rich guy who had too much time on his hands

another famous photog AVEDON: once I saw his notes for dodge-burning a print what a hoot
5% corrections in a cheek for example and about twenty more circled areas where he wanted dodge or burn in small amounts for one face in a portrait

I think Avedon’s printer would’ve loved Photoshop where that kind of specificity is a whole lot easier than trying to cram in all that dodge burn under a safelight in under 30 seconds

most of us have to produce commercially and more quickly and haven’t the time to sit in the desert for days waiting for that perfect moment and the necessity of getting on the "negative" is less important than it used to be with film and before retouching and digital

OK I know all you artsy fartsy purists gonna blast this post as Ansel is considered some god of photography and I have uttered blasphemes of the ZONE SYSTEM here
don’t bother
J
jjs
Mar 19, 2008
"granny" wrote in message

BTW.. I have used that huge lens mounted on my 4×5

[said in the voice of Crocodile Dundee] Ar, that ain’t a huge lens. This is a huge lens: http://www.digoliardi.net/super_biogon_2.jpg (it is not the 75mm Biogon)
J
jjs
Mar 19, 2008
"KatWoman" wrote in message

granny ZONE SYSTEM is ancient history in photography

I’m sure that is obvious, but does being old diminish its value?

just the shortest version here: Ansel recommended a lot of different zones each with varying exposures
to bring out maximum tonality in specific areas of BW images

Exposure, filtration and development. Don’t forget development

he was also famous for making endless prints before being satisfied

You point being?

while I would never criticize his work for most of us it is a very tedious method of capture
and really applies to artsy fartsy landscape images he produced

Oh, that’s gonna leave a mark.

another famous photog AVEDON: once I saw his notes for dodge-burning a print
what a hoot
5% corrections in a cheek for example and about twenty more circled areas where he wanted dodge or burn in small amounts for one face in a portrait

What is wrong with desiring perfection?

I think Avedon’s printer would’ve loved Photoshop where that kind of specificity is a whole lot easier than trying to cram in all that dodge burn under a safelight in under 30 seconds

There was a long line of excellent printers who would have loved to do the wet darkroom work for Avedon.

most of us have to produce commercially and more quickly and haven’t the time to sit in the desert for days waiting for that perfect moment and the necessity of getting on the "negative" is less important than it used to be with film and before retouching and digital

So you are proud to be a hack. That explains everything.
G
granny
Mar 19, 2008
<jjs> wrote in message
"granny" wrote in message

BTW.. I have used that huge lens mounted on my 4×5

[said in the voice of Crocodile Dundee] Ar, that ain’t a huge lens. This is a huge lens: http://www.digoliardi.net/super_biogon_2.jpg (it is not the 75mm Biogon)
She Swooons… OOOH ! and squeales in delight.. "It’s sooo BIG !! I hope it is Rectilinear"
J
jjs
Mar 19, 2008
"granny" wrote in message
<jjs> wrote in message

[said in the voice of Crocodile Dundee] Ar, that ain’t a huge lens. This is a huge lens: http://www.digoliardi.net/super_biogon_2.jpg (it is not the 75mm Biogon)
She Swooons… OOOH ! and squeales in delight.. "It’s sooo BIG !! I hope it is Rectilinear"

It certainly is. Right straight up there.
G
granny
Mar 19, 2008
<jjs> wrote in message
"granny" wrote in message
<jjs> wrote in message

[said in the voice of Crocodile Dundee] Ar, that ain’t a huge lens. This is a huge lens: http://www.digoliardi.net/super_biogon_2.jpg (it is not the 75mm Biogon)
She Swooons… OOOH ! and squeales in delight.. "It’s sooo BIG !! I hope it is Rectilinear"

It certainly is. Right straight up there.

Promises, Cubed… I don’t believe anything you say anymore.. You said you would provide me a step by step if I gave you something…

For someone of your apparent expertise, I ask a relative simple question, to wit:
~~~~~~~
"Could you explain please what this new ‘Zone System’ is with step by step
instructions…"
~~~~~~~~~
You even Quoted the request so your answer would not be mis-interpreted and stated, "Sure, just as soon as you post step-by-step instructions for brain surgery"
~~~~~~~~~
I did… You didn’t!! Liar,Liar!

Besides that Big Ol thing you showed me probably isn’t capable of being Rectilinear any more and as old as it looks probably is moldy and doesn’t shoot right because of inactivity.. That little aperture might even be rusted shut..

I feel sooo let down and just plain USED!! AGAIN!! I am very disappointed in you!

No need to reply now, Others on this Ng have NOT skirted the issue as you did and have been very helpful indeed.

Besides I think we have carried this BS far enough and sufficiently hijacked this thread..and I wouldn’t want you to get to excited with all this double entendre..

FWIW.. I have spent many hours under a blackout cloth in the early morning and late evening sun looking at an upside down image on a piece of glass trying to make things look good.. Then do it all over again in the darkroom.. Been there done that and forgot most of it!

Ain’t Photoshop GREAT!!

Laters,
Granny
G
granny
Mar 19, 2008
<jjs> wrote in message

Kat is one of my favorites on here and is a SWEET hack who needs no explanation or justification!

"Granny"
D
Dave
Mar 19, 2008
On Wed, 19 Mar 2008 00:19:43 -0500, "granny"
wrote:

Promises, Cubed… I don’t believe anything you say anymore.. You said you would provide me a step by step if I gave you something…
For someone of your apparent expertise, I ask a relative simple question, to wit:
~~~~~~~
"Could you explain please what this new ‘Zone System’ is with step by step
instructions…"
~~~~~~~~~
You even Quoted the request so your answer would not be mis-interpreted and stated, "Sure, just as soon as you post step-by-step instructions for brain surgery"
~~~~~~~~~
I did… You didn’t!! Liar,Liar!

Laters,
Granny

He proved himself a liar. You even went as far as studying overnight in order to bring your side of the agreement. At least, you scored a doctors degree – he lost the respect of the crew.

Dave
G
granny
Mar 19, 2008
"Dave" wrote in message
On Wed, 19 Mar 2008 00:19:43 -0500, "granny"
wrote:

Promises, Cubed… I don’t believe anything you say anymore.. You said you would provide me a step by step if I gave you something…
For someone of your apparent expertise, I ask a relative simple question, to wit:
~~~~~~~
"Could you explain please what this new ‘Zone System’ is with step by step
instructions…"
~~~~~~~~~
You even Quoted the request so your answer would not be mis-interpreted
and stated, "Sure, just as soon as you post step-by-step instructions for brain surgery"
~~~~~~~~~
I did… You didn’t!! Liar,Liar!

Laters,
Granny

He proved himself a liar. You even went as far as studying overnight in order to bring your side of the agreement. At least, you scored a doctors degree – he lost the respect of the crew.

Dave

The sweet essence of vindication, Thank you Dave!
"Granny"
P
Pudentame
Mar 20, 2008
granny wrote:
"John" wrote in message
On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 16:52:58 -0400, "KatWoman" wrote:

It’s called the Zone System. You should try it with a real camera.
JD
LOL

OK ANSEL
Me and my 5X7 Linhof thank you very much however I’m closer to being someone in the shadow of Ansel. Boy would he have had a ball my Panasonic 10MP though !

JD

"To photograph truthfully and effectively is to see beneath the surfaces and record the qualities of nature and humanity which live or are latent in all things." – Ansel Adams (1902-1984

Could you explain please what this new ‘Zone System’ is with step by step instructions… I want to see below surface like x-ray
Thank you in advance

http://www.amazon.com/Camera-Ansel-Adams-Photography-Book/dp /0821221841
K
KatWoman
Mar 20, 2008
<jjs> wrote in message
"KatWoman" wrote in message

granny ZONE SYSTEM is ancient history in photography

I’m sure that is obvious, but does being old diminish its value?
just the shortest version here: Ansel recommended a lot of different zones each with varying exposures
to bring out maximum tonality in specific areas of BW images

Exposure, filtration and development. Don’t forget development
he was also famous for making endless prints before being satisfied

You point being?

while I would never criticize his work for most of us it is a very tedious method of capture
and really applies to artsy fartsy landscape images he produced

Oh, that’s gonna leave a mark.

another famous photog AVEDON: once I saw his notes for dodge-burning a print
what a hoot
5% corrections in a cheek for example and about twenty more circled areas where he wanted dodge or burn in small amounts for one face in a portrait

What is wrong with desiring perfection?

I think Avedon’s printer would’ve loved Photoshop where that kind of specificity is a whole lot easier than trying to cram in all that dodge burn under a safelight in under 30 seconds

There was a long line of excellent printers who would have loved to do the wet darkroom work for Avedon.

most of us have to produce commercially and more quickly and haven’t the time to sit in the desert for days waiting for that perfect moment and the necessity of getting on the "negative" is less important than it used to be with film and before retouching and digital

So you are proud to be a hack. That explains everything.

1. I am not a photographer, I fix photos

where is your work oh great and talented one?
do you use the zone system daily?

What is wrong with desiring perfection?
I said his technique is NOT for everyone ("while I would never criticize his work" is what I did say, next time read what it says., not what you would like it to say )

2. unlike yourself at least I can comprehend what I read (what part of "don’t bother" you do not understand?)

yes I have blasphemed the god of photography
and I said it UP FRONT

"purists gonna blast this post as Ansel is
considered some god of photography and I have uttered blasphemes of the ZONE SYSTEM here"

told ya so folks

always more horse’s asses than horses
I see why most of the really good people quit posting here
K
KatWoman
Mar 20, 2008
<jjs> wrote in message
"KatWoman" wrote in message

granny ZONE SYSTEM is ancient history in photography

I’m sure that is obvious, but does being old diminish its value?
just the shortest version here: Ansel recommended a lot of different zones each with varying exposures
to bring out maximum tonality in specific areas of BW images

Exposure, filtration and development. Don’t forget development
he was also famous for making endless prints before being satisfied

You point being?

while I would never criticize his work for most of us it is a very tedious method of capture
and really applies to artsy fartsy landscape images he produced

Oh, that’s gonna leave a mark.

another famous photog AVEDON: once I saw his notes for dodge-burning a print
what a hoot
5% corrections in a cheek for example and about twenty more circled areas where he wanted dodge or burn in small amounts for one face in a portrait

What is wrong with desiring perfection?

I think Avedon’s printer would’ve loved Photoshop where that kind of specificity is a whole lot easier than trying to cram in all that dodge burn under a safelight in under 30 seconds

There was a long line of excellent printers who would have loved to do the wet darkroom work for Avedon.

most of us have to produce commercially and more quickly and haven’t the time to sit in the desert for days waiting for that perfect moment and the necessity of getting on the "negative" is less important than it used to be with film and before retouching and digital

So you are proud to be a hack. That explains everything.

granny ZONE SYSTEM is ancient history in photography

I’m sure that is obvious, but does being old diminish its value?

again YOU are unable to read?
granny had not heard of it so, my comment refers to that

the value judgment I never implied is your fantasy of what I said DO NOT PUT YOUR WORDS INTO MY MOUTH THEY TASTE AND SMELL BAD
P
Pudentame
Mar 20, 2008
KatWoman wrote:

OK I know all you artsy fartsy purists gonna blast this post as Ansel is considered some god of photography and I have uttered blasphemes of the ZONE SYSTEM here
don’t bother

I don’t know if this is considered a BLAST, but I like his work. I don’t consider it artsy fartsy, and I’m no purist.

The Zone System is/was essentially his method of getting the best out of the materials available at the time. If Adams were shooting today, he’d use digital in addition to his medium format and large format work; probably be scanning those 8×10 negatives.

And he’d be using Photoshop to accomplish the same things he accomplished by exposure, development and dodging & burning his prints back in the wet darkroom days.

Say what you will about Ansel, even after he’s been dead for 24 years, he’s still still selling more prints than either one of us. His work seems to have stood up to the test of time. At least so far.
J
jjs
Mar 25, 2008
"KatWoman" wrote in message
<jjs> wrote in message
[… big snip…]

1. I am not a photographer, I fix photos

Oh. Never needed one.

where is your work oh great and talented one?

Surf and ye shall find. I use a pseudonym.

do you use the zone system daily?

Modified ZS. The Zonnies system is way overboard. Made for a lot of scholarship. Not a significant improvement to the simplified version.

2. unlike yourself at least I can comprehend what I read (what part of "don’t bother" you do not understand?)

What part of Usenet do you not understand?

always more horse’s asses than horses
I see why most of the really good people quit posting here

Another hackneyed Usnet quip. Try better.
J
jjs
Mar 25, 2008
"KatWoman" wrote in message

DO NOT PUT YOUR WORDS INTO MY MOUTH THEY TASTE AND SMELL BAD

No. Your mouth was like that before.

MacBook Pro 16” Mockups 🔥

– in 4 materials (clay versions included)

– 12 scenes

– 48 MacBook Pro 16″ mockups

– 6000 x 4500 px

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