file Backup strategies?

F
Posted By
frankg
Feb 26, 2006
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892
Replies
17
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Closed
I have hundreds of 8 & 16 bit psd /tif files to backup to an external usb hard drive.
I dont like the program that came with the drive much (retrospect express) and dont like the fact that it uses a propritory compression as in the future on another machine it may pose a problem to access the files. I was wondering about just using Windows Explorer to copy the files across, or using a popular zipping program (winzip or winrar) to compress the folders and then copy them, or use the built in Windows backup utility, or if there’s another very popular and standard backup program to get?

thanks
Frank


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A
adykes
Feb 26, 2006
In article <B7iMf.119$>,
frankg wrote:
I have hundreds of 8 & 16 bit psd /tif files to backup to an external usb hard drive.
I dont like the program that came with the drive much (retrospect express) and dont like the fact that it uses a propritory compression as in the future on another machine it may pose a problem to access the files. I was wondering about just using Windows Explorer to copy the files across, or using a popular zipping program (winzip or winrar) to compress the folders and then copy them, or use the built in Windows backup utility, or if there’s another very popular and standard backup program to get?

*everyone’s* backup formats are proprietary[2] unless you use some open source tool. the tar utility from Unix/Linux , ported to Windows would work fine but I’m not recommending it for you.

Since PSD and TIF file don’t compress you don’t lose anything if you don’t use backup software and just copy files. xcopy (a windows command) will do fine. "xopy /?" will list all the commands and a google for xcopy will find lots of examples.

ntbackup is included in all 32 bit version of Windows[1] since about 1992 and would be widely replicated if Microsoft should cease to distribute it in the next version of Windows.

Somewhat in a tangent. You shouldn’t have just one backup disk. You need two, at least. Sh*t happens and you never want to be writing on your only backup when it does. Read this;

http://www.taobackup.com/

[1] Not in W/98 or course and not installed by default on XP/home but it’s on the CD.

[2] ISTR an industry effort to standardize backup formats. It was in the 90s and I don’t know what happened to the project.


a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m

Don’t blame me. I voted for Gore.
JJ
John John
Feb 26, 2006
"Al Dykes" wrote in message

Since PSD and TIF file don’t compress you don’t lose anything if you don’t use backup software and just copy files. xcopy (a windows command) will do fine. "xopy /?" will list all the commands and a google for xcopy will find lots of examples.

I haven’t tried to compress any PSD files, but I’ve zipped (using Winzip) TIF’s for years and get 30-40% compression.

Somewhat in a tangent. You shouldn’t have just one backup disk. You need two, at least. Sh*t happens and you never want to be writing on your only backup when it does. Read this;

Yes, I have two copies locally and carry it one step beyond that by keeping one external drive off-site, updating it once every three weeks. The house could burn down, of course, and since my livelihood is somewhat dependent on these images, it is good insurance.

Don’t blame me. I voted for Gore.

….and Kerry.
MR
Mike Russell
Feb 26, 2006
"frankg" wrote in message
I have hundreds of 8 & 16 bit psd /tif files to backup to an external usb hard drive.
I dont like the program that came with the drive much (retrospect express) and dont like the fact that it uses a propritory compression as in the future on another machine it may pose a problem to access the files. I was wondering about just using Windows Explorer to copy the files across, or using a popular zipping program (winzip or winrar) to compress the folders and then copy them, or use the built in Windows backup utility, or if there’s another very popular and standard backup program to get?

Hi Frank,

Zip is an open source format, and it is built into Windows XP, so I’d recommend you go with that format. PSD and uncompressed zip files compress just fine.

What didn’t you like about retrospect?

Mike Russell
www.curvemeister.com
F
frankg
Feb 26, 2006
Thanks all – i think I’ll just copy/paste to the external drive – that way a regular uncompressed psd/tif can be opened by any machine with PS installed – no zip or other proprietory format to get past first

"frankg" wrote in message
I have hundreds of 8 & 16 bit psd /tif files to backup to an external usb hard drive.
I dont like the program that came with the drive much (retrospect express) and dont like the fact that it uses a propritory compression as in the future on another machine it may pose a problem to access the files. I was wondering about just using Windows Explorer to copy the files across, or using a popular zipping program (winzip or winrar) to compress the folders and then copy them, or use the built in Windows backup utility, or if there’s another very popular and standard backup program to get?

thanks
Frank


=========
A
adykes
Feb 26, 2006
In article <dxoMf.1369$>,
frankg wrote:
Thanks all – i think I’ll just copy/paste to the external drive – that way a regular uncompressed psd/tif can be opened by any machine with PS installed – no zip or other proprietory format to get past first

If your external drive is formatted NTFS and the compression feature is turned on you will get almost as much compression as zip would give you.

Make sure you dismount the drive cleanly with the "unplug of eject" icon in your tool tray. this is *VERY* important for what you are doing.

"frankg" wrote in message
I have hundreds of 8 & 16 bit psd /tif files to backup to an external usb hard drive.
I dont like the program that came with the drive much (retrospect express) and dont like the fact that it uses a propritory compression as in the future on another machine it may pose a problem to access the files. I was wondering about just using Windows Explorer to copy the files across, or using a popular zipping program (winzip or winrar) to compress the folders and then copy them, or use the built in Windows backup utility, or if there’s another very popular and standard backup program to get?

thanks
Frank


=========


a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m

Don’t blame me. I voted for Gore.
F
frankg
Feb 27, 2006
You are right !
I just learned the hard way and didnt follow that procedure and now my machine is in a real muddle
============
If your external drive is formatted NTFS and the compression feature is turned on you will get almost as much compression as zip would give you.

Make sure you dismount the drive cleanly with the "unplug of eject" icon in your tool tray. this is *VERY* important for what you are doing.

"frankg" wrote in message
I have hundreds of 8 & 16 bit psd /tif files to backup to an external usb hard drive.
I dont like the program that came with the drive much (retrospect express)
and dont like the fact that it uses a propritory compression as in the future on another machine it may pose a problem to access the files. I was wondering about just using Windows Explorer to copy the files across, or using a popular zipping program (winzip or winrar) to compress
the folders and then copy them, or use the built in Windows backup utility, or if there’s another very popular and standard backup program to
get?

thanks
Frank


=========


a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m

Don’t blame me. I voted for Gore.
S
SpaceGirl
Feb 27, 2006
Al Dykes wrote:
In article <dxoMf.1369$>,
frankg wrote:
Thanks all – i think I’ll just copy/paste to the external drive – that way a regular uncompressed psd/tif can be opened by any machine with PS installed – no zip or other proprietory format to get past first

If your external drive is formatted NTFS and the compression feature is turned on you will get almost as much compression as zip would give you.

Make sure you dismount the drive cleanly with the "unplug of eject" icon in your tool tray. this is *VERY* important for what you are doing.

Not strictly true. These days most USB drives are quite happy to be unplugged while active; Windows doesn’t care (although OSX Tiger seems far more sensitive — it really does not like me swappingy my memory stick without ejecting first, while Windows XP is fine with exactly the same stick). The only drives that seem to choke are ones with proprietry drives – which should be avoided anyway!
A
adykes
Feb 27, 2006
In article ,
SpaceGirl wrote:
Al Dykes wrote:
In article <dxoMf.1369$>,
frankg wrote:
Thanks all – i think I’ll just copy/paste to the external drive – that way a regular uncompressed psd/tif can be opened by any machine with PS installed – no zip or other proprietory format to get past first

If your external drive is formatted NTFS and the compression feature is turned on you will get almost as much compression as zip would give you.

Make sure you dismount the drive cleanly with the "unplug of eject" icon in your tool tray. this is *VERY* important for what you are doing.

Not strictly true. These days most USB drives are quite happy to be unplugged while active; Windows doesn’t care (although OSX Tiger seems far more sensitive — it really does not like me swappingy my memory stick without ejecting first, while Windows XP is fine with exactly the same stick). The only drives that seem to choke are ones with proprietry drives – which should be avoided anyway!

I’m not talking about damaging the hardware. If all the files and buffers haven’t been flushed before you yank the device you lose files.

Is a "proprietry drive" one that requires it’s own driver?


a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m

Don’t blame me. I voted for Gore.
S
SpaceGirl
Feb 27, 2006
Al Dykes wrote:

I’m not talking about damaging the hardware. If all the files and buffers haven’t been flushed before you yank the device you lose files.

That’s true. Not sure I’d want caching outside of the physical drive with any external device anyway, and I’d hope that most devices have enough stored energy to flush any caches once removed from a connection.

Is a "proprietry drive" one that requires it’s own driver?

Wrong term, sorry 😛 But, take for example my cellphone. I use it as a storage device (it has a 1024mb memory stick in it). If I plug it into a PC via USB2, Windows requires a driver to be able to access it. If I plug it into my PowerBook, it just works. My old phone didn’t need a driver for either. It’s weird. I really dont want to have to carry a driver around with me "just in case" I want to plug it into something. I just want it to work!
A
adykes
Feb 27, 2006
In article ,
SpaceGirl wrote:
Al Dykes wrote:

I’m not talking about damaging the hardware. If all the files and buffers haven’t been flushed before you yank the device you lose files.

That’s true. Not sure I’d want caching outside of the physical drive with any external device anyway, and I’d hope that most devices have enough stored energy to flush any caches once removed from a connection.

The buffers are in the PC, not the USB device. If they’re not written out when the file is copied, you lose. See "File System Consistancy".


a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m

Don’t blame me. I voted for Gore.
U
usenet
Feb 27, 2006
frankg wrote:

I have hundreds of 8 & 16 bit psd /tif files to backup to an external usb hard drive.
I dont like the program that came with the drive much (retrospect express) and dont like the fact that it uses a propritory compression as in the future on another machine it may pose a problem to access the files. I was wondering about just using Windows Explorer to copy the files across, or using a popular zipping program (winzip or winrar) to compress the folders and then copy them, or use the built in Windows backup utility, or if there’s another very popular and standard backup program to get?

I’ve been looking at rdiff-backup, which is a script in Python. I haven’t built up the courage to try it out on my files yet, though. It copies your files, and then on subsequent backups records the differences between the current backup and the previous, rather than keeping the old version of the file as a whole.

<http://www.nongnu.org/rdiff-backup/>

It might not be available in a Windows distribution, but I’m not sure.
S
SpaceGirl
Feb 28, 2006
Al Dykes wrote:
In article ,
SpaceGirl wrote:
Al Dykes wrote:

I’m not talking about damaging the hardware. If all the files and buffers haven’t been flushed before you yank the device you lose files.

That’s true. Not sure I’d want caching outside of the physical drive with any external device anyway, and I’d hope that most devices have enough stored energy to flush any caches once removed from a connection.

The buffers are in the PC, not the USB device. If they’re not written out when the file is copied, you lose. See "File System Consistancy".

I’m not sure this is true for all devices. For example, my hard drives on my main graphics machine have 16mb caches on them. Those are physical caches, nothing to do with Windows. If the power goes out the caches are supposed to get flushed. I guess the drives hold enough power in capasitors to spin down safely.

Does Windows cache writes to USB devices? I’m pretty sure it doesn’t. It might cache reads, but that doesn’t matter.

I’m not sure either way – but so long as the device tells me it’s okay I wont think about it 🙂
NE
nesredep egrob
Feb 28, 2006
On Mon, 27 Feb 2006 15:12:35 -0800, (Paul Mitchum) wrote:

frankg wrote:

I have hundreds of 8 & 16 bit psd /tif files to backup to an external usb hard drive.
I dont like the program that came with the drive much (retrospect express) and dont like the fact that it uses a propritory compression as in the future on another machine it may pose a problem to access the files. I was wondering about just using Windows Explorer to copy the files across, or using a popular zipping program (winzip or winrar) to compress the folders and then copy them, or use the built in Windows backup utility, or if there’s another very popular and standard backup program to get?

I’ve been looking at rdiff-backup, which is a script in Python. I haven’t built up the courage to try it out on my files yet, though. It copies your files, and then on subsequent backups records the differences between the current backup and the previous, rather than keeping the old version of the file as a whole.

<http://www.nongnu.org/rdiff-backup/>

It might not be available in a Windows distribution, but I’m not sure.

I use Acronis and store the files directly to an external USB2 storage 200 GB disk. Just as well to have plenty storage and avoid compression. Try it for free and it is not too expensive to buy.

Borge in sunny Perth, Australia
A
adykes
Feb 28, 2006
In article ,
nesredep egrob wrote:
On Mon, 27 Feb 2006 15:12:35 -0800, (Paul Mitchum) wrote:
frankg wrote:

I have hundreds of 8 & 16 bit psd /tif files to backup to an external usb hard drive.
I dont like the program that came with the drive much (retrospect express) and dont like the fact that it uses a propritory compression as in the future on another machine it may pose a problem to access the files. I was wondering about just using Windows Explorer to copy the files across, or using a popular zipping program (winzip or winrar) to compress the folders and then copy them, or use the built in Windows backup utility, or if there’s another very popular and standard backup program to get?

I’ve been looking at rdiff-backup, which is a script in Python. I haven’t built up the courage to try it out on my files yet, though. It copies your files, and then on subsequent backups records the differences between the current backup and the previous, rather than keeping the old version of the file as a whole.

<http://www.nongnu.org/rdiff-backup/>

It might not be available in a Windows distribution, but I’m not sure.

I use Acronis and store the files directly to an external USB2 storage 200 GB disk. Just as well to have plenty storage and avoid compression. Try it for free and it is not too expensive to buy.

I’m a big fan of Acronis. The software is called TrueImage and I use it on many systems. Mostly I do full image backup. I also burn lots of CDs to save copies of work product. TI (or any crash recovery backup tool) needs to be tested completely with *your* hardware if you expect to recover with a bootable CD. That’s what 30 day trials are for.

I’m not a fan of external backpack disk drives. They are subject to to many faults and failures, IMO. At the very least, you need two of them and have to flip-flip between them and keep one off-site. This is necessary because a system or device faiilure while you are writing on your only (or latest) backup is a worst case scenario. sh*t happens.

I distrust large disks in tiny, hot, boxes powered from wall warts, connected with crappy USB cables. Call me paraniod.

I’ve got several computers on a LAN and the big desktop has two 200GB disks in it. One use of these disks is to store generations of images of all my machines done over the LAN with TI. The Desktop does it’s own backup backup disk-to-disk with TI. I flipflop between disks on alternative days. TI does it all.

I’ve got my really important stuff off-site on CDs. Don’t get me started about CD lifetimes except to say that my CDs, properly stored will outlast your non-name USB disk drive.


a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m

Don’t blame me. I voted for Gore.
CB
coal_brona
Mar 3, 2006
Hi,

You can try Disk Image utility, that is a really useful data backup tool. It is powerful and always worked great for me. The tool itself can be found on a data tools set CD image Active@ boot Disk that also includes mighty programs for data recovery and erase.

http://www.ntfs.com/boot-disk.htm
MR
Mike Russell
Mar 3, 2006
wrote in message
Hi,

You can try Disk Image utility, that is a really useful data backup tool. It is powerful and always worked great for me. The tool itself can be found on a data tools set CD image Active@ boot Disk that also includes mighty programs for data recovery and erase.

http://www.ntfs.com/boot-disk.htm
Good point. What’s great about an imaging utility such as this one is that you can restore your system from the metal, without any need to install windows first. This means you’ll have your system up and running within an hour or two, instead of a period of days to rebuild your system from install disks.

Drive Image is a similar utility that I’ve found works very well. —

Mike Russell
www.curvemeister.com
A
adykes
Mar 3, 2006
In article <d_SNf.17836$>,
Mike Russell wrote:
wrote in message
Hi,

You can try Disk Image utility, that is a really useful data backup tool. It is powerful and always worked great for me. The tool itself can be found on a data tools set CD image Active@ boot Disk that also includes mighty programs for data recovery and erase.

http://www.ntfs.com/boot-disk.htm
Good point. What’s great about an imaging utility such as this one is that you can restore your system from the metal, without any need to install windows first. This means you’ll have your system up and running within an hour or two, instead of a period of days to rebuild your system from install disks.

Drive Image is a similar utility that I’ve found works very well.

If you’re using an external disk drive, USB or FW, or have something other than standard IDE inside your box you need to test the backup tool on *your* machine, including a demonstration that can restore to bare metal.

Anything that requires drivers can screw you when you try to restore.


a d y k e s @ p a n i x . c o m

Don’t blame me. I voted for Gore.

Must-have mockup pack for every graphic designer 🔥🔥🔥

Easy-to-use drag-n-drop Photoshop scene creator with more than 2800 items.

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