Windows ME to XP ?

"Terry" wrote in message

I only need an "upgrade" right? and since I’m at home and not on a

corporate

server, I just need the "home" edition right?

IF you MUST…………. Get Professional. Adobe works better with the professional versus home edition.

"Terry" wrote in message

I only need an "upgrade" right?

Yes, and ME doesn’t even have to be installed, as long as you have an original CDROM of it.

and since I’m at home and not on a corporate server, I just need the "home" edition right?

Both will work.

Bart

"Terry" wrote in message

I only need an "upgrade" right? and since I’m at home and not on a

corporate

server, I just need the "home" edition right?

Terry: I have recently made that upgrade from ME to XP. The Microsoft upgrade option works fine for Photoshop 7 onto XP Home edition. If using Microsoft Outlook Express, make sure that you backup your mail, inbox, outbox, etc and any personal folders: After the upgrade, XP presented me with everything else intact except my mail folders. It is possible to recover but easier to backup first.

DONT trust Microsoft Backup under ME. XP will not read it!

David.

"David Leadbeater" wrote in message

"Terry" wrote in message

I only need an "upgrade" right? and since I’m at home and not on a

corporate

server, I just need the "home" edition right?

Terry: I have recently made that upgrade from ME to XP. The Microsoft upgrade option works fine for Photoshop 7 onto XP Home edition. If using Microsoft Outlook Express, make sure that you backup your mail, inbox, outbox, etc and any personal folders: After the upgrade, XP presented me with everything else intact except my mail folders. It is possible to recover but easier to backup first.

DONT trust Microsoft Backup under ME. XP will not read it!

There are a few advanced features in Photoshop CS that won’t work well with Home Edition. Professional doesn’t cost that much more.

"" wrote in message
SNIP

There are a few advanced features in Photoshop CS that won’t work well with Home Edition.

Please elaborate.

Bart

In article <yfSNb.26272$>,
says…

IF you MUST…………. Get Professional. Adobe works better with the professional versus home edition.

Um, sure. Care to explain ?

(Adobe is a compnay by the way, not a product).

—
Regards,
Ian Firth

"Bart van der Wolf" wrote in message

There are a few advanced features in Photoshop CS that won’t work well with Home Edition.

Please elaborate.

I do not recall them all, but when I was doing the upgrade from 7.0 to 8.0 there was a list of new features, and Adobe suggested using Professional Edition for certain applications. They didn’t apply to my basic needs and I already had XP Professional so I didn’t note them. But with the small difference in cost of the Professional series, I’d go for the better version.

"Ian Firth" wrote in message

In article <yfSNb.26272$>,
says…

IF you MUST…………. Get Professional. Adobe works better with the professional versus home edition.

Um, sure. Care to explain ?

(Adobe is a compnay by the way, not a product).

I am well aware of that. There is also Adobe Acrobat. DUHH!

I’d love to know what they are as I’ve never heard of them. XP Prof carries a lot of extra stuff that is unnecesary for many users and may run slower than XP Home in general. Given that CS is a pretty memory hungry beast, it may even run better on Home although I must say I’ve not seen a comparison.

"" wrote in message

"Bart van der Wolf" wrote in message

There are a few advanced features in Photoshop CS that won’t work well with Home Edition.

Please elaborate.

I do not recall them all, but when I was doing the upgrade from 7.0 to 8.0 there was a list of new features, and Adobe suggested using Professional Edition for certain applications. They didn’t apply to my basic needs and

I

already had XP Professional so I didn’t note them. But with the small difference in cost of the Professional series, I’d go for the better version.

"Mick" wrote in message

I’d love to know what they are as I’ve never heard of them. XP Prof

carries

a lot of extra stuff that is unnecesary for many users and may run slower than XP Home in general. Given that CS is a pretty memory hungry beast, it may even run better on Home although I must say I’ve not seen a

comparison.

I would guess it runs slower in XP pro too. Most everything does. It has more bugs than an ant farm, only slightly more than home edition. Later versions of ME were almost bulletproof. XP is EXTREMELY vulnerable to many virus and MANY Trojans. Both versions. Anti-virus programs are virtually useless with XP, Norton is easily taken out. Some of the newer versions of SWEN nail Norton straightaway. I suggest Professional only if you are using the most advanced features of Photoshop such as transporting the files within other graphics platforms such as Front Page, or Publisher. I do NOT profess to be an expert on this, it is just what my IT people tell me and what I saw upon installation.

"" wrote in message

I would guess it runs slower in XP pro too. Most everything does. It has more bugs than an ant farm, only slightly more than home edition. Later versions of ME were almost bulletproof. XP is EXTREMELY vulnerable to many virus and MANY Trojans. Both versions. Anti-virus programs are virtually useless with XP, Norton is easily taken out. Some of the newer versions of SWEN nail Norton straightaway. I suggest Professional only if you are using
the most advanced features of Photoshop such as transporting the files within other graphics platforms such as Front Page, or Publisher. I do NOT profess to be an expert on this, it is just what my IT people tell me and what I saw upon installation.

Photoshop CS requires Windows 2000 SP3 or XP. I’d guess XP Pro would fit the bill better if you use CS in a group environment with WebDav or Version Cue (but Version Cue requires the full CS suite, not just Photoshop) There is nothing in XP Pro that will make Photoshop editing work better than on XP Home.

Now to the ME is more stable than XP. Excuse me? ME had to be most unstable excuse of an OS MS ever released. It’s pretty hard for an app to crash XP, trivial for an app to crash ME (and 95 or 98). If an anti virus program can be taken out in XP, it can be taken out a lot easier in ME. You can run XP as a normal user instead of with full admin privileges as an added level of protection. Unfortunately, so much software out there requires registry changes/permission changes to run with normal user privileges. If you use Pro, you can set up ACLs to protect your files, but MS decided that having this capability in XP Home would cause too many support calls (they disabled the Encrypted File System capability as well) and they probably made the right call.

Zyg

"Zyg" wrote in message

Now to the ME is more stable than XP. Excuse me? ME had to be most unstable excuse of an OS MS ever released. It’s pretty hard for an app to crash XP, trivial for an app to crash ME (and 95 or 98). If an anti virus program can be taken out in XP, it can be taken out a lot easier in ME.

You

can run XP as a normal user instead of with full admin privileges as an added level of protection. Unfortunately, so much software out there requires registry changes/permission changes to run with normal user privileges. If you use Pro, you can set up ACLs to protect your files,

but

MS decided that having this capability in XP Home would cause too many support calls (they disabled the Encrypted File System capability as well) and they probably made the right call.

I never had ME crash. I have had many crashes on XP. For no apparent reason it seems to occasionally just erase itself. And XP is extremely vulnerable to a virus or Trojan within an email even IF you don’t open them. MANY outfits are exploiting SERIOUS FLAWS in XP that allow an email message to trigger popups when unattended. This is most true of emails sent by porn spammers. Even IF you never visit a porn site you can find hidden virus and Trojans. About 40% of the SPY programs now contain Trojans. And you get this crap from many LEGIT websites. I was visiting a site looking for a specific midi file, and was CLOBBERED by all sorts of porn popups, some with viruses. Many render virus scanners like Norton inoperative. They also bypass programs like ADAWARE and SPY SWEEPER! XP is WIDE OPEN to attacks that were only minimally a problem on ME.

"" wrote in message

And XP is extremely vulnerable
to a virus or Trojan within an email even IF you don’t open them. MANY outfits are exploiting SERIOUS FLAWS in XP that allow an email message to trigger popups when unattended. This is most true of emails sent by porn spammers.

Are you talking about Windows XP or IE6? I have XP Pro and don’t have anywhere near the problems you seem to be having. Perhaps you are having difficulty setting up the OS. Granted there are flaws, just as Win9X had flaws during its reign. However, crashing more frequently than Win 9x is not what many users have experienced. Perhaps it is time for you to do a fresh install.

"" wrote in message
SNIP

I never had ME crash.

Mine was also pretty stable, but it did occasionally freeze (not crash).

I have had many crashes on XP.

I have had none (XP Pro) since upgrading almost a year ago. Only a beta (alpha?) version of an application caused an infinite loop in a driver, from which XP automatically recovered. Your crashes may be caused by driver incompatibility (most common cause).

For no apparent reason it seems to occasionally just erase itself. And XP is extremely vulnerable to a virus or Trojan within an email even IF you don’t open them.

There are a few vulnerabilities one should fix.
First, get a good Firewall like ZoneAlarm (but that has little to do with XP).
Second, plug a few holes with the utilities from http://grc.com .

Bart

"" wrote in message

I would guess it runs slower in XP pro too. Most everything does. It has more bugs than an ant farm, only slightly more than home edition. Later versions of ME were almost bulletproof. XP is EXTREMELY vulnerable to many virus and MANY Trojans. Both versions. Anti-virus programs are virtually useless with XP, Norton is easily taken out. Some of the newer versions of SWEN nail Norton straightaway. I suggest Professional only if you are using
the most advanced features of Photoshop such as transporting the files within other graphics platforms such as Front Page, or Publisher.

I do NOT
profess to be an expert on this, it is just what my IT people tell me and what I saw upon installation.

Your IT people are making a fool of you. Just about every single think you said is dead wrong. XP Pro is so superior to ME it’s laughable. I pitty you for those "IT people" you have.

"Jimmy" wrote in message

Are you talking about Windows XP or IE6? I have XP Pro and don’t have

anywhere near the problems

you seem to be having. Perhaps you are having difficulty setting up the

OS. Granted there are

flaws, just as Win9X had flaws during its reign. However, crashing more

frequently than Win 9x is

not what many users have experienced. Perhaps it is time for you to do a

fresh install.

Many have experienced it. Again, if you have much web presence, you are vulnerable to the MANY gaping holes in XP for internet vandals to screw with you. And there are MANY little children with modems who have NOTHING at all to do except play games. Hence the SWEN virus, MANY Trojans and the current Pay Pal bug in such wide distribution.

"Bart van der Wolf" wrote in message

I never had ME crash.

Mine was also pretty stable, but it did occasionally freeze (not crash).

Oh so did I, it always traced to the program I was running and NOT ME itself.

I have had many crashes on XP.

I have had none (XP Pro) since upgrading almost a year ago. Only a beta (alpha?) version of an application caused an infinite loop in a driver,

from

which XP automatically recovered. Your crashes may be caused by driver incompatibility (most common cause).

XP has some issues with lots of software, but it has HUGE holes in it that are EASILY exploited by internet vandals. Microsoft knows about them. They just are INCAPABLE of closing them! Or, maybe they don’t want to. Look at the TONS of spyware being written. It all operates in the background with those little data miners. NOTHING you havce on your system ABSOLUTELY NOTHING regardless of how hard you TRY to hide it, NOTHING can’t be obtained via XP with thopse gigantic tunnels in the code.

For no apparent reason it seems to occasionally just erase itself. And XP is extremely vulnerable to a virus or Trojan within an email even IF you don’t open them.

There are a few vulnerabilities one should fix.
First, get a good Firewall like ZoneAlarm (but that has little to do with XP).
Second, plug a few holes with the utilities from http://grc.com .

"jjs" wrote in message

Your IT people are making a fool of you. Just about every single think you said is dead wrong. XP Pro is so superior to ME it’s laughable. I pitty you for those "IT people" you have.

XP is in many ways superior to ME. In some ways it is NOT. It is the latest Windows 95. Microsoft does NOT KNOW HOW to build a stable operating system. IF it was at all practical I would switch to the MAC today. There are two obstacles for that.

1. The MAC is unreasonably overpriced.
2. I would be the 4th user outside Apple headquarters to have one! (JOKE)
3. 90% of the software I use is NOT available for the MAC. (Professional
software)

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 13:20:51 GMT, ""
wrote:

"jjs" wrote in message

Your IT people are making a fool of you. Just about every single think you said is dead wrong. XP Pro is so superior to ME it’s laughable. I pitty you for those "IT people" you have.

XP is in many ways superior to ME. In some ways it is NOT. It is the latest Windows 95.

ME is the last DOS based version (3.x-> 95-> 98-> ME).

XP is the latest NT based version (NT4-> W2k-> XP)

Most exploits you mentioned result from IE or Outlook being used without a proper firewall installed.

Microsoft does NOT KNOW HOW to build a stable operating
system.

Even this is not correct. I surely believe in the developer’s ability to create a stable OS. But why should they bother as long as no customer knows such thing as a stable OS exists?

Michael

"Xalinai" wrote in message

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 13:20:51 GMT, ""
wrote:

"jjs" wrote in message

Your IT people are making a fool of you. Just about every single think

you

said is dead wrong. XP Pro is so superior to ME it’s laughable. I pitty you for those "IT people" you have.

XP is in many ways superior to ME. In some ways it is NOT. It is the latest Windows 95.

ME is the last DOS based version (3.x-> 95-> 98-> ME).
XP is the latest NT based version (NT4-> W2k-> XP)
Most exploits you mentioned result from IE or Outlook being used without a proper firewall installed.

Microsoft does NOT KNOW HOW to build a stable operating
system.

Even this is not correct. I surely believe in the developer’s ability to create a stable OS. But why should they bother as long as no customer knows such thing as a stable OS exists?

The infections came through my NETSCRAPE.
I am also on high speed. T-1

"" wrote:

"Xalinai" wrote in message

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 13:20:51 GMT, ""
wrote:

"jjs" wrote in message

Your IT people are making a fool of you. Just about every single think

you

said is dead wrong. XP Pro is so superior to ME it’s laughable. I pitty you for those "IT people" you have.

XP is in many ways superior to ME. In some ways it is NOT. It is the latest Windows 95.

ME is the last DOS based version (3.x-> 95-> 98-> ME).
XP is the latest NT based version (NT4-> W2k-> XP)
Most exploits you mentioned result from IE or Outlook being used without a proper firewall installed.

Microsoft does NOT KNOW HOW to build a stable operating
system.

Even this is not correct. I surely believe in the developer’s ability to create a stable OS. But why should they bother as long as no customer knows such thing as a stable OS exists?

The infections came through my NETSCRAPE.
I am also on high speed. T-1

As Mr. van der Wolf already pointed out (and you apparently ignored), many of the net/web vulnerabilities of XP can be very easily addressed by putting up a proper firewall like ZoneAlarm and it you don’t need a bunch of bells and whistles, the freeware version will do the job nicely.

I did it myself when I went from NT (a rock solid OS) to XP (a not so stable but still better than ME) OS and it works like a charm.

MS deserves no kudos for literally opening up security holes in XP that didn’t exist under NT but continuing to carry on about it when simple solutions exist isn’t exactly productive either.
—
Mike

In article <jJ9Ob.6136$>,
says…

(Adobe is a compnay by the way, not a product).

I am well aware of that. There is also Adobe Acrobat. DUHH!

You’re not too bright are you ?

Adobe works better with the professional versus home edition.

You posted that "Adobe" worked better with XP Pro. Well "Adobe" is a company, and it’s impossible for "Adobe" to work better with XP Pro.

Does this make sense now ?

—
Regards,
Ian Firth

Now wait a minute your last statement isn’t true. If Adobe has Windows XP Pro on all of their systems Adobe (the company) could very well be working better since they would have fewer crashes to deal with which would mean productivity was up which means Adobe (the company) is running better. 8^)

Jerry

"Ian Firth" wrote in message

In article <jJ9Ob.6136$>,
says…

(Adobe is a compnay by the way, not a product).

I am well aware of that. There is also Adobe Acrobat. DUHH!

You’re not too bright are you ?

Adobe works better with the professional versus home edition.

You posted that "Adobe" worked better with XP Pro. Well "Adobe" is a company, and it’s impossible for "Adobe" to work better with XP Pro.
Does this make sense now ?

—
Regards,
Ian Firth

"Mike Richmann" wrote in message

As Mr. van der Wolf already pointed out (and you apparently ignored), many of the net/web vulnerabilities of XP can be very easily addressed by putting up a proper firewall like ZoneAlarm and it you don’t need a bunch of bells and whistles, the freeware version will do the job nicely.

I did it myself when I went from NT (a rock solid OS) to XP (a not so stable but still better than ME) OS and it works like a charm.
MS deserves no kudos for literally opening up security holes in XP that didn’t exist under NT but continuing to carry on about it when simple solutions exist isn’t exactly productive either.

I have NT on my lab computer and 2000 on one of my laptops. Firewalls like Zone Alarm do NOTHING WHATSOEVER even minimally for the things that creep in via e-mails. The HOLES in XP are so cavernous that malicious spammers are exploiting the hell out of them, some emails contain DOZENS of "pop up" spam! And nothing in XP deals well with them, not even raising the security level to its maximum. XP is like a SUPER HIGHWAY for spammers. And even an 11 year old can write a robotic program to generate not only spam POP UPS, but include in those pop ups code that will DISABLE Norton COMPLETELY and prevent you from EVER restoring Norton on that drive. Hell, they can do any damn thing they want to. Doesn’t make ANY difference whether your mail program is Oultook Express, Outlook, Netscrape, Eudora or what. The PROBLEM is in the operating system of Windows XP……………….. ME is not quite as bad. Some of the crap won’t ERASE your operating system in ME, it just puts crap everywhere that with loads of effort can be removed. If ANYONE on the planet was using a MAC I would switch in a microsecond. WINDOWS SUCKS! MS has NEVER written a solid program YET! Their BEST work is DOG FECES! That have a monopoly and only God (Bill Gates) knows why!

"Ian Firth" wrote in message

In article <jJ9Ob.6136$>,
says…

(Adobe is a compnay by the way, not a product).

I am well aware of that. There is also Adobe Acrobat. DUHH!

You’re not too bright are you ?

GROW UP!

wrote:

"Zyg" wrote in message

Now to the ME is more stable than XP. Excuse me? ME had to be most unstable excuse of an OS MS ever released. It’s pretty hard for an app to crash XP, trivial for an app to crash ME (and 95 or 98). If an anti virus program can be taken out in XP, it can be taken out a lot easier in ME.

You

can run XP as a normal user instead of with full admin privileges as an added level of protection. Unfortunately, so much software out there requires registry changes/permission changes to run with normal user privileges. If you use Pro, you can set up ACLs to protect your files,

but

MS decided that having this capability in XP Home would cause too many support calls (they disabled the Encrypted File System capability as well) and they probably made the right call.

I never had ME crash. I have had many crashes on XP. For no apparent reason it seems to occasionally just erase itself. And XP is extremely vulnerable to a virus or Trojan within an email even IF you don’t open them. MANY outfits are exploiting SERIOUS FLAWS in XP that allow an email message to trigger popups when unattended. This is most true of emails sent by porn spammers. Even IF you never visit a porn site you can find hidden virus and Trojans. About 40% of the SPY programs now contain Trojans. And you get this crap from many LEGIT websites. I was visiting a site looking for a specific midi file, and was CLOBBERED by all sorts of porn popups, some with viruses. Many render virus scanners like Norton inoperative. They also bypass programs like ADAWARE and SPY SWEEPER! XP is WIDE OPEN to attacks that were only minimally a problem on ME.

Well said, Mr. KRP.

Uni – A Proud Windows ME user

Ian Firth …

In article <jJ9Ob.6136$>,
says…

(Adobe is a compnay by the way, not a product).

I am well aware of that. There is also Adobe Acrobat. DUHH!

You’re not too bright are you ?

Adobe works better with the professional versus home edition.

You posted that "Adobe" worked better with XP Pro. Well "Adobe" is a company, and it’s impossible for "Adobe" to work better with XP Pro.
Does this make sense now ?

Ian read this: http://www.aboutkenpangborn.com and you’ll know what that fool said what he said. Kenneth Pangborn is an ignoramous.

"Uni" wrote in message

I never had ME crash. I have had many crashes on XP. For no apparent

reason

it seems to occasionally just erase itself. And XP is extremely

vulnerable

to a virus or Trojan within an email even IF you don’t open them. MANY outfits are exploiting SERIOUS FLAWS in XP that allow an email message

to

trigger popups when unattended. This is most true of emails sent by porn spammers. Even IF you never visit a porn site you can find hidden virus

and

Trojans. About 40% of the SPY programs now contain Trojans. And you get

this

crap from many LEGIT websites. I was visiting a site looking for a

specific

midi file, and was CLOBBERED by all sorts of porn popups, some with viruses. Many render virus scanners like Norton inoperative. They also bypass programs like ADAWARE and SPY SWEEPER! XP is WIDE OPEN to attacks that were only minimally a problem on ME.

Well said, Mr. KRP.

Thanks, there are several places on the net where you can read about thousands of people swearing at MS and the XP debacle. There were idiots wildly praising Windows 95 too.

"" wrote in news:9uZOb.28565$ko5.3351
@nwrddc01.gnilink.net:

"Ian Firth" wrote in message

In article <jJ9Ob.6136$>,
says…

(Adobe is a compnay by the way, not a product).

I am well aware of that. There is also Adobe Acrobat. DUHH!

You’re not too bright are you ?

GROW UP!

You meant to spell that Y-E-S.

You’re welcome, freak.

"Robert Gautier" wrote in message

Ian read this: http://www.aboutkenpangborn.com and you’ll know what that fool said what he said. Kenneth Pangborn is an ignoramous.

No Moore, an IGNORAMUS would be a dork who chases after me from newsgroup to newsgroup all day EVERY day of his life for 7 years. A dork who doesn’t feed his family because he is spending almost EVERY waking hour obsessed with me and STALKING me all over the net.

"Jimmy" wrote in
news:qmmOb.4332$:

"" wrote in message

And XP is extremely vulnerable
to a virus or Trojan within an email even IF you don’t open them. MANY outfits are exploiting SERIOUS FLAWS in XP that allow an email message to trigger popups when unattended. This is most true of emails sent by porn spammers.

Are you talking about Windows XP or IE6?

He’s full of shit. Outlook Express and VB scripting work pretty much identically on both platforms, as far as such things are concerned.

XP/2K DID have a serious point of vulnerability that ME doesn’t, but Pangborn here obviously has no idea what that was.

<snip>

"" wrote:

"Mike Richmann" wrote in message

As Mr. van der Wolf already pointed out (and you apparently ignored), many of the net/web vulnerabilities of XP can be very easily addressed by putting up a proper firewall like ZoneAlarm and it you don’t need a bunch of bells and whistles, the freeware version will do the job nicely.

I did it myself when I went from NT (a rock solid OS) to XP (a not so stable but still better than ME) OS and it works like a charm.
MS deserves no kudos for literally opening up security holes in XP that didn’t exist under NT but continuing to carry on about it when simple solutions exist isn’t exactly productive either.

I have NT on my lab computer and 2000 on one of my laptops. Firewalls like Zone Alarm do NOTHING WHATSOEVER even minimally for the things that creep in via e-mails. The HOLES in XP are so cavernous that malicious spammers are exploiting the hell out of them, some emails contain DOZENS of "pop up" spam! And nothing in XP deals well with them, not even raising the security level to its maximum. XP is like a SUPER HIGHWAY for spammers. And even an 11 year old can write a robotic program to generate not only spam POP UPS, but include in those pop ups code that will DISABLE Norton COMPLETELY and prevent you from EVER restoring Norton on that drive. Hell, they can do any damn thing they want to. Doesn’t make ANY difference whether your mail program is Oultook Express, Outlook, Netscrape, Eudora or what. The PROBLEM is in the operating system of Windows XP……………….. ME is not quite as bad. Some of the crap won’t ERASE your operating system in ME, it just puts crap everywhere that with loads of effort can be removed. If ANYONE on the planet was using a MAC I would switch in a microsecond. WINDOWS SUCKS! MS has NEVER written a solid program YET! Their BEST work is DOG FECES! That have a monopoly and only God (Bill Gates) knows why!

1) Take a pill.

2) ZoneAlarm passes every port sniffing test I’ve ever seen and also renames and sequesters any pif, executable, etc. coming in through your e-mail.

3) If you’re also damned fool enough not to use a spamkiller for your e-mail, open said e-mails and get redirected and infected, you deserve everything you get. And if you fail to scan your machine for spyware, ditto.

4) Norton’s not the only anti-viral out there. Use a different program (Symantec, AVG, etc.) and fix the problem instead of carrying on about it.

Long answer short: no one I know who’s taken proper measures to firewall their machine and prescreen their e-mail has suffered the fate you’re ranting about. As I said before, XP’s no prince but your stance is hardly productive when examined in the light of day.
—
Mike

Robert Gautier wrote:

Ian Firth …

In article <jJ9Ob.6136$>,
says…

(Adobe is a compnay by the way, not a product).

I am well aware of that. There is also Adobe Acrobat. DUHH!

You’re not too bright are you ?

Adobe works better with the professional versus home edition.

You posted that "Adobe" worked better with XP Pro. Well "Adobe" is a company, and it’s impossible for "Adobe" to work better with XP Pro.
Does this make sense now ?

Ian read this: http://www.aboutkenpangborn.com and you’ll know what that fool said what he said. Kenneth Pangborn is an ignoramous.

And a raving maniac from way back. Brings back fond memories of Matt Giwer and Bob McElwaine…
—
Mike

"Eric Gill" wrote in message

"Jimmy" wrote in
news:qmmOb.4332$:

"" wrote in message

And XP is extremely vulnerable
to a virus or Trojan within an email even IF you don’t open them. MANY outfits are exploiting SERIOUS FLAWS in XP that allow an email message to trigger popups when unattended. This is most true of emails sent by porn spammers.

Are you talking about Windows XP or IE6?

He’s full of shit. Outlook Express and VB scripting work pretty much identically on both platforms, as far as such things are concerned.
XP/2K DID have a serious point of vulnerability that ME doesn’t, but Pangborn here obviously has no idea what that was.

Microsoft ADMITS to over 24 of them!

"Mike Richmann" wrote in message

2) ZoneAlarm passes every port sniffing test I’ve ever seen and also renames and sequesters any pif, executable, etc. coming in through your e-mail.

Neither Zone Alarm or Norton actually do stop things that enter through e-mail popups. Are you sayign that you "NEVER" see any popups in ANY emails you get?

3) If you’re also damned fool enough not to use a spamkiller for your e-mail, open said e-mails and get redirected and infected, you deserve everything you get. And if you fail to scan your machine for spyware, ditto.

You don’t have to "OPEN" the emails. Even just sitting there the popups can and DO infect your system. Software like Spy Sweeper wash a data miner off your system AFTER it has already nested. SOME of the spy software will nest in places that it is almost impossible to remove. Some of it attacks Norton.

4) Norton’s not the only anti-viral out there. Use a different program (Symantec, AVG, etc.) and fix the problem instead of carrying on about it.

Symantic IS Norton. You may mean McAffee. Hell, that is weaker than Norton.

Long answer short: no one I know who’s taken proper measures to firewall their machine and prescreen their e-mail has suffered the fate you’re ranting about. As I said before, XP’s no prince but your stance is hardly productive when examined in the light of day.

Some of the NEW popups are infected. It is only a matter of time before more people get nailed with it.

In article <bAWOb.9530$
says…

Now wait a minute your last statement isn’t true. If Adobe has Windows XP Pro on all of their systems Adobe (the company) could very well be working better since they would have fewer crashes to deal with which would mean productivity was up which means Adobe (the company) is running better. 8^)

You make a valid point 😉

—
Regards,
Ian Firth

In article <ia3Pb.1484$>,
says…

Neither Zone Alarm or Norton actually do stop things that enter through e-mail popups. Are you sayign that you "NEVER" see any popups in ANY emails you get?

Never.
It seems that you have several hijack applications on your system that are doing your web browsing for you, opening whatever windows they want. I recommend hiring a professional to clean up your computer for you, since who knows how much crap it’s passing on to the rest of the world.

—
Regards,
Ian Firth

Ian Firth …

In article <ia3Pb.1484$>,
says…

Neither Zone Alarm or Norton actually do stop things that enter through e-mail popups. Are you sayign that you "NEVER" see any popups in ANY emails you get?

Never.
It seems that you have several hijack applications on your system that are doing your web browsing for you, opening whatever windows they want. I recommend hiring a professional to clean up your computer for you, since who knows how much crap it’s passing on to the rest of the world.

His usenet posts alone give the rest of the world enough pollution. http://www.aboutkenpangborn.com

"" wrote:

"Mike Richmann" wrote in message

2) ZoneAlarm passes every port sniffing test I’ve ever seen and also renames and sequesters any pif, executable, etc. coming in through your e-mail.

Neither Zone Alarm or Norton actually do stop things that enter through e-mail popups. Are you sayign that you "NEVER" see any popups in ANY emails you get?

Not a one. But then again, I take my own advice.

3) If you’re also damned fool enough not to use a spamkiller for your e-mail, open said e-mails and get redirected and infected, you deserve everything you get. And if you fail to scan your machine for spyware, ditto.

You don’t have to "OPEN" the emails. Even just sitting there the popups can and DO infect your system. Software like Spy Sweeper wash a data miner off your system AFTER it has already nested. SOME of the spy software will nest in places that it is almost impossible to remove. Some of it attacks Norton.

Unless an e-mail’s opened, it *cannot* execute.

It sounds like Mr. Firth already has the best answer here. Your system’s polluted well beyond your apparent ability to fix it and his recommendation to get an IT pro to straighten it out would be highly advised.

4) Norton’s not the only anti-viral out there. Use a different program (Symantec, AVG, etc.) and fix the problem instead of carrying on about it.

Symantic IS Norton. You may mean McAffee. Hell, that is weaker than Norton.

Yeah, McAfee. And AVG’s an even better approach since virus writers don’t target it and it’s free as well.

Long answer short: no one I know who’s taken proper measures to firewall their machine and prescreen their e-mail has suffered the fate you’re ranting about. As I said before, XP’s no prince but your stance is hardly productive when examined in the light of day.

Some of the NEW popups are infected. It is only a matter of time before more people get nailed with it.

Oh brother. Here, use aluminum foil. It’s cheaper than pills. —
Mike

"" wrote in news:h53Pb.1450$h77.1070
@nwrddc02.gnilink.net:

"Eric Gill" wrote in message

"Jimmy" wrote in
news:qmmOb.4332$:

"" wrote in message

And XP is extremely vulnerable
to a virus or Trojan within an email even IF you don’t open them. MANY outfits are exploiting SERIOUS FLAWS in XP that allow an email message to trigger popups when unattended. This is most true of emails sent by porn spammers.

Are you talking about Windows XP or IE6?

He’s full of shit. Outlook Express and VB scripting work pretty much identically on both platforms, as far as such things are concerned.
XP/2K DID have a serious point of vulnerability that ME doesn’t, but Pangborn here obviously has no idea what that was.

Microsoft ADMITS to over 24 of them!

It’s interesting (well, not really) that Pangborn expects anyone to take his word on it, given his track record.

Mike Richmann wrote in
news::

Robert Gautier wrote:

Ian Firth wrote in message
news:…

In article <jJ9Ob.6136$>,
says…

(Adobe is a compnay by the way, not a product).

I am well aware of that. There is also Adobe Acrobat. DUHH!

You’re not too bright are you ?

Adobe works better with the professional versus home edition.

You posted that "Adobe" worked better with XP Pro. Well "Adobe" is a company, and it’s impossible for "Adobe" to work better with XP Pro.

Does this make sense now ?

Ian read this: http://www.aboutkenpangborn.com and you’ll know what that fool said what he said. Kenneth Pangborn is an ignoramous.

And a raving maniac from way back. Brings back fond memories of Matt Giwer

Talk.Origins, as of yesterday.

and Bob McElwaine…

Do not invoke the McEloony, He Who Is Not Named.

We could all regret it.

Besides, he showed up in T.O. not all that long ago, and gave up in short order. I guess we all get older.

"Ian Firth" wrote in message

Neither Zone Alarm or Norton actually do stop things that enter

through

e-mail popups. Are you sayign that you "NEVER" see any popups in ANY

emails

you get?

Never.
It seems that you have several hijack applications on your system that are doing your web browsing for you, opening whatever windows they want. I recommend hiring a professional to clean up your computer for you, since who knows how much crap it’s passing on to the rest of the world.

Zone Alarm was one of several Firewall programs I used at one time or another. Black Ice Defender and so on. The vulnerability is through e-mails. Most MS operating systems are vulnerable, the code is written so haphazardly. But XP is a virtual sieve. MS KNOWS it but says; "SCREW YOU. GET A DIFFERENT OS IF YOU DON’T LIKE IT!" They KNOW about the holes, they even speak of it in their technical bulletins. One hacker has even put antagonizing messages making fun of Gates refusal to repair the screw up. You mistake the Microsoft Empire for somebody who actually gives a S@#$!

There is more than one hole to exploit. And if you see even ONE popup in an email the bet is that you HAVE an infected system. At one time it was pretty hard to pickup an infection, the user had to take some action, like opening up an email attachment. With the FLAWS there are today, the operator doesn’t have to do a thing. There was a day you could get a virus at a porn site. Today you don’t need to visit them. Now even the MOST legit websites have popup, MANY, unknown to the website owners, have FATAL infections in them. EVEN IF you NEVER visit ANY websites of ANY kind, you CAN get infected. You don’t even have to post on Usenet to give MALEVOLENT SPAMMERS your address. Somebody ELSE can go on.If somebody goes on who has YOU in their mailbox, you WILL eventually get nailed! IF there were a realistic choice, I’d switch to a MAC today. The MAC systems are SO SUPERIOR to the PC level machines it’s silly. BUT…………………………………… NOBODY has MACS………….. Most of the proprietary software I need is NOT available for the MAC.
So, like it or not I am stuck with the PC when I would really PREFER to have a MAC, and I have to live with PISS POOR MS operating systems. I never thought it possible but XP is actually WORSE than Windows 95!

Eric Gill wrote:

Mike Richmann wrote in
news::

Robert Gautier wrote:

Ian Firth wrote in message
news:…

In article <jJ9Ob.6136$>,
says…

(Adobe is a compnay by the way, not a product).

I am well aware of that. There is also Adobe Acrobat. DUHH!

You’re not too bright are you ?

Adobe works better with the professional versus home edition.

You posted that "Adobe" worked better with XP Pro. Well "Adobe" is a company, and it’s impossible for "Adobe" to work better with XP Pro.

Does this make sense now ?

Ian read this: http://www.aboutkenpangborn.com and you’ll know what that fool said what he said. Kenneth Pangborn is an ignoramous.

And a raving maniac from way back. Brings back fond memories of Matt Giwer

Talk.Origins, as of yesterday.

and Bob McElwaine…

Do not invoke the McEloony, He Who Is Not Named.

We could all regret it.

Besides, he showed up in T.O. not all that long ago, and gave up in short order. I guess we all get older.

Errr, why not? Afterall, di$$emination of thi$ document is widely encouraged.

Hehe…
—
Mike

"Mike Richmann" wrote

<snip>

scan your machine for spyware,

I’ve heard of it/them: virus-like programs that Symantec, etc. don’t normally filter or look for, yes? A brief description or website, please.

Are there free downloadable ‘spyware stopper’ programs, or are they only sold at stores? If so, brand names?

Thanks

Are there free downloadable ‘spyware stopper’ programs, or are they only sold at stores?

http://www.lavasoftusa.com/

"Nev" wrote:

Are there free downloadable ‘spyware stopper’ programs, or are they only sold at stores?

http://www.lavasoftusa.com/

http://www.safer-networking.org/

Nev wrote:

"Mike Richmann" wrote

<snip>

scan your machine for spyware,

I’ve heard of it/them: virus-like programs that Symantec, etc. don’t normally filter or look for, yes? A brief description or website, please.
Are there free downloadable ‘spyware stopper’ programs, or are they only sold at stores? If so, brand names?

LavaSoft’s AdAware is a reasonably well known program and they offer a freeware version:

Start here: http://www.lavasoft.de

rather than the poorly formatted lavasoftusa.com site and follow the link under software to AdAware, read the info and then follow the "download" link on the right to get the AdAware 6 executable. —
Mike

Nev wrote:

"Mike Richmann" wrote

<snip>

scan your machine for spyware,

I’ve heard of it/them: virus-like programs that Symantec, etc. don’t normally filter or look for, yes? A brief description or website, please.
Are there free downloadable ‘spyware stopper’ programs, or are they only sold at stores? If so, brand names?

Ad-Ware, I believe, is a decent, free, spyware stopper. I never had to use it with Windows ME, but a friend of mine had to use it with Windows XP.

Uni

Thanks

wrote:

"Uni" wrote in message

I never had ME crash. I have had many crashes on XP. For no apparent

reason

it seems to occasionally just erase itself. And XP is extremely

vulnerable

to a virus or Trojan within an email even IF you don’t open them. MANY outfits are exploiting SERIOUS FLAWS in XP that allow an email message

to

trigger popups when unattended. This is most true of emails sent by porn spammers. Even IF you never visit a porn site you can find hidden virus

and

Trojans. About 40% of the SPY programs now contain Trojans. And you get

this

crap from many LEGIT websites. I was visiting a site looking for a

specific

midi file, and was CLOBBERED by all sorts of porn popups, some with viruses. Many render virus scanners like Norton inoperative. They also bypass programs like ADAWARE and SPY SWEEPER! XP is WIDE OPEN to attacks that were only minimally a problem on ME.

Well said, Mr. KRP.

Thanks, there are several places on the net where you can read about thousands of people swearing at MS and the XP debacle. There were idiots wildly praising Windows 95 too.

Here’s how I feel. If you’re computer illiterate, then use Windows XP, since it’s the AOL of operating systems.

Uni

wrote:

Zone Alarm was one of several Firewall programs I used at one time or another. Black Ice Defender and so on. The vulnerability is through e-mails. Most MS operating systems are vulnerable, the code is written so haphazardly. But XP is a virtual sieve. MS KNOWS it but says; "SCREW YOU. GET A DIFFERENT OS IF YOU DON’T LIKE IT!" They KNOW about the holes, they even speak of it in their technical bulletins. One hacker has even put antagonizing messages making fun of Gates refusal to repair the screw up. You mistake the Microsoft Empire for somebody who actually gives a S@#$!

And you think you can get a better deal elsewhere?! All operating systems suffer from problems – just to a lesser or greater degree. Go to Windowsupdate.com and calm down.

And what exactly do you mean when you say "Pop ups"?

Cheers,
Nicholas Sherlock

Many thanks, all.

"Nicholas Sherlock" wrote in message
SNIP

And what exactly do you mean when you say "Pop ups"?

He’s clueless, and doesn’t know how to disable HTML display of mail, which might contain some scripts wich can also be disabled.

Bart

From: "Nev"
Newsgroups: comp.graphics.apps.photoshop

Are there free downloadable ‘spyware stopper’ programs, or are they only sold at stores?

http://www.lavasoftusa.com/

HAD IT! Didn’t SLOW the tojans down!
Did NOT stop spyware or popups.

(ADAWARE etc)

From: Uni
Newsgroups: comp.graphics.apps.photoshop

Ad-Ware, I believe, is a decent, free, spyware stopper. I never had to use it with Windows ME, but a friend of mine had to use it with Windows XP.

BINGO! But some things in E-Mail that doesn’t touch. Does a good job on websites ONLY!

"Kenpangborn" wrote

http://www.lavasoftusa.com/

HAD IT! Didn’t SLOW the tojans down!
Did NOT stop spyware or popups.

How so? What happened or, rather, how were you able to tell they didn’t stop the spyware, etc.? Did you contact the manufacturer in response?

"" wrote in message

"Mick" wrote in message

I would guess it runs slower in XP pro too. Most everything does. It has more bugs than an ant farm, only slightly more than home edition. Later versions of ME were almost bulletproof. XP is EXTREMELY vulnerable to many virus and MANY Trojans. Both versions. Anti-virus programs are virtually useless with XP, Norton is easily taken out. Some of the newer versions of SWEN nail Norton straightaway. I suggest Professional only if you are

using

the most advanced features of Photoshop such as transporting the files within other graphics platforms such as Front Page, or Publisher. I do NOT profess to be an expert on this, it is just what my IT people tell me and what I saw upon installation.

Your "IT people" are misinformed. I’ve been building systems for 22 years, all using M$ OS’s except my first Osborne 1, and have never contracted a virus or worm. I’ve run NAV and it has been doing well catching what few get through my hardware firewall.

As for bugs, could you name some? I’ve been running XP Pro for almost a year and it has yet to crash, not even once. What bugs do I have that I have not yet discerned? As for slowness, XP has been shown in tests to be the fastest of the OS’s from Win95 to date, so what speed problems can you specifically cite?

"" wrote in message

"Jimmy" wrote in message

Many have experienced it. Again, if you have much web presence, you

are

vulnerable to the MANY gaping holes in XP for internet vandals to screw

with

you. And there are MANY little children with modems who have NOTHING at

all

to do except play games. Hence the SWEN virus, MANY Trojans and the

current

Pay Pal bug in such wide distribution.

Many have experienced "gaping holes," and they are the people that don’t protect their systems. Simple precautions (anti-virus software and a firewall) will keep the viruses and worms away. I’ve been computing for 22 years, all but my first running M$ OS’s, and have never contracted a virus or worm. It just takes a bit of common sense and an informed security strategy, which includes performing Windows Updates, an anti-virus ute, and a firewall (hardware or software). It really isn’t that difficult.

"" wrote in message

"Mike Richmann" wrote in message

I have NT on my lab computer and 2000 on one of my laptops. Firewalls

like

Zone Alarm do NOTHING WHATSOEVER even minimally for the things that creep

in

via e-mails. The HOLES in XP are so cavernous that malicious spammers are exploiting the hell out of them, some emails contain DOZENS of "pop up" spam! And nothing in XP deals well with them, not even raising the

security

level to its maximum. XP is like a SUPER HIGHWAY for spammers. And even an 11 year old can write a robotic program to generate not only spam POP UPS, but include in those pop ups code that will DISABLE Norton COMPLETELY and prevent you from EVER restoring Norton on that drive. Hell, they can do

any

damn thing they want to. Doesn’t make ANY difference whether your mail program is Oultook Express, Outlook, Netscrape, Eudora or what. The

PROBLEM

is in the operating system of Windows XP……………….. ME is not

quite

as bad. Some of the crap won’t ERASE your operating system in ME, it just puts crap everywhere that with loads of effort can be removed. If ANYONE

on

the planet was using a MAC I would switch in a microsecond. WINDOWS SUCKS! MS has NEVER written a solid program YET! Their BEST work is DOG FECES! That have a monopoly and only God (Bill Gates) knows why!

I don’t normally stoop to flaming, but you’ve crossed the line. Not only are you misinformed, but you’re foolish for mindlessly sucking in and exaggerating whatever your "IT people" have told you. Try this, regardless of the OS you are running, some applicable even to Apple systems:

(1) If you are having stability problems in XP you either have an errant driver or faulty hardware.
(2) Install a firewall, preferably hardware (router). If software, Zonealarm is an excellent choice.
(3) Install a good anti-virus package. I use NAV and have never gotten a virus or worm.
(4) Install an anti-spam ute. I use Spampal and very few spam messages get through. It is freeware.
(5) Run AdAware or Spybot to rid your machine of adware and spyware. (6) Run a registry checker periodically to keep the registry clean and uncluttered.

I followed these procedures in Win98SE and now in XP Pro, and I have no crashes, glitches, or other malfunctions.

"" wrote in message

Neither Zone Alarm or Norton actually do stop things that enter

through

e-mail popups. Are you sayign that you "NEVER" see any popups in ANY

emails

you get?

Never. Get a knowledgeable person to help you clean your machine of spyware and hijacking scumware. I helped a friend the other day who had 450 iterations of spyware and adware in his system, which caused the machine to come to a crawl and behave in a manner you have described. Suggestion: Run AdAware or Spybot.

You don’t have to "OPEN" the emails. Even just sitting there the popups

can

and DO infect your system. Software like Spy Sweeper wash a data miner off your system AFTER it has already nested. SOME of the spy software will

nest

in places that it is almost impossible to remove. Some of it attacks

Norton.

Try a hardware firewall.

Some of the NEW popups are infected. It is only a matter of time before more people get nailed with it.

I get no popups. Clean your system! You’ve been hijacked, so quit blaming M$ and just go clean it out!

From: "Nev"
Newsgroups: comp.graphics.apps.photoshop

HAD IT! Didn’t SLOW the tojans down!
Did NOT stop spyware or popups.

How so? What happened or, rather, how were you able to tell they didn’t stop the spyware, etc.? Did you contact the manufacturer in response?

Well let’s see, a simnple way to SHOW that the spyware was NOT blocked from the system, is that when you do a SWEEP, it find them! IF it had bloc ked them there would not be any there! Ferstenzie?

Also the POP UPS for EVERY PORN SITE in the world were just a little OBVIOUS all over the screen considering that I don’t go to PORN sites.

Also a clue on the Trojanes were that they DEACTIVATED Norton, corrupted the hell out of it, Norton reported that my system had Trojans and that it COULD NOT deactivate them!

That about does it for me. Any other questions, class?

Reply-To: "Bob Davis"
From: "Bob Davis"

I’ve been running XP Pro for almost a

year and it has yet to crash, not even once. What bugs do I have that I have not yet discerned?

Go to the MS website, last time I checked MS admitted to over 30,000, and that is only the bugs they ADMIT to!

As for slowness, XP has been shown in tests to be the fastest of the OS’s from

Win95 to date, so what speed problems can you specifically cite?

Where to start. Some of it is the problem of vendors like Symantic, but it is also a problem with MS not givinf vendors like Symantic the code right away. There are HUGE compatibility problems between XP Pro and The Internet security software.

ail
Reply-To: "Bob Davis"
From: "Bob Davis"
Newsgroups: comp.graphics.apps.photoshop

Many have experienced "gaping holes," and they are the people that don’t protect their systems. Simple precautions (anti-virus software and a firewall) will keep the viruses and worms away.

Look, I don’t need a pissing contest here.
But many people have system infections and don’t know it. Infections reporting all kinds of things to others. Many THOUSANDS of people have had things like credit card numbers hijacked off their systems. Sometimes by vendors, sometimes by 13 year old malicious kids playing pranks.

Some of the holes are so bad that one ELEVEN YEAR OLD exploited, that he even infected the machine at the MS headquarters and it was ridiculing Gates himself. I understand there were some really funny images of gates. MS is like swiss cheese. MS knows it, they don’t give a flying F@#$!

It just takes a bit of common sense and an informed security strategy, which includes performing Windows Updates, an anti-virus ute, and a firewall (hardware or software). It really isn’t that difficult.

If KIDS can bring down the department of Denefnse system, and can even crash the FAA air net, do you think that YOU can’t be had? Lots of this stuff is being donee by KIDS who have NO parental supervision, the OLD MAN of the pinks was not caught till he was 18!

Reply-To: "Bob Davis"
From: "Bob Davis"
Newsgroups: comp.graphics.apps.photoshop

don’t normally stoop to flaming, but you’ve crossed the line. Not only are you misinformed, but you’re foolish for mindlessly sucking in and exaggerating whatever your "IT people" have told you.

(1) If you are having stability problems in XP you either have an errant driver or faulty hardware.

Pretty good stuff here,

2) Install a firewall, preferably hardware (router). If software, Zonealarm is an excellent choice.

I HAVE a router, I also have a FIREWALL.
I am not STUPID enough to announce it on Usenet tp advise the punks on the EASY WAY into my system.

(3) Install a good anti-virus package. I use NAV and have never gotten a virus or worm.

Funny I also use NAV, AND about 80% of the new worms are built specitifcally to ATTACK NAV and to DISABLE IT!

You see, we’re dealing with not completely formed humans. 11 Year olds. And when you announce you have Zone Alarm they are going to not sleep until they have written code to BLAST Zone Alarm, or Norton or whatever.

I had one of the FIRST PC’s ever made. I used a CPM unit before than and a machine language desktop before that.

5) Run AdAware or Spybot to rid your machine of adware and

Had it, it lasted longer than anything else, but the latest SPAM programs, shove it out of the way as well.

I am telling you these kids are determiend to play games. And some of them are MUCH smarter than the code writers at MS etc. And some of the older ones, just experimenting work for your UNCLE…

Kenpangborn wrote:

Reply-To: "Bob Davis"
From: "Bob Davis"

I’ve been running XP Pro for almost a

year and it has yet to crash, not even once. What bugs do I have that I
have not yet discerned?

Go to the MS website, last time I checked MS admitted to over 30,000, and that is only the bugs they ADMIT to!

And you think you could get a better experience somewhere else?! All operating systems have bugs.

Cheers,
Nicholas Sherlock

"Nicholas Sherlock" wrote in message

Kenpangborn wrote:

Reply-To: "Bob Davis"
From: "Bob Davis"

I’ve been running XP Pro for almost a

year and it has yet to crash, not even once. What bugs do I have that I
have not yet discerned?

Go to the MS website, last time I checked MS admitted to over 30,000, and that is only the bugs they ADMIT to!

And you think you could get a better experience somewhere else?! All operating systems have bugs.

When Apple began one of their recent advertising campaigns they made much of the "Blue Screen of Death."
Let is not forget at the much heralded unveiling by Bill Gates of the new XP operating system, when it booted it crapped out into a BLUE SCREEN and LOCKED more solid than a uranium bullet. They went to a slide presentation because NOBODY could make it boot!

The OS from Apple seem to be very stable. I think some others are as well. HOWEVER – – – you run into conflicts because MS plays games with its code on programs like MS Office 2003. (It hates Norton 2004)