will adobe support the new amd 64 and the new microdoft 64 bit os?

L
Posted By
langley61
Feb 17, 2004
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603
Replies
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Now that the AMD 64bit processor is in wide release and Microsoft has released it’s public beta of the next windows xp 64, will Abobe release a patch or upgrade to photoshop to support it?
Curious to see if anyone on this forum has heard any new concerning this.

-long time photoshop user. I’ve have every upgrade from version 2.0 to CS.
Just got a AMD 64 computer. Will install the 64 bit os beta soon.

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F
Flycaster
Feb 17, 2004
"elven" wrote in message
Now that the AMD 64bit processor is in wide release and Microsoft has released it’s public beta of the next windows xp 64, will Abobe release a patch or upgrade to photoshop to support it?
Curious to see if anyone on this forum has heard any new concerning this.

-long time photoshop user. I’ve have every upgrade from version 2.0 to CS.
Just got a AMD 64 computer. Will install the 64 bit os beta soon.

Good question – but I doubt it’ll be a "patch." 😉

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B
Brian
Feb 17, 2004
Now that the AMD 64bit processor is in wide release and Microsoft has released it’s public beta of the next windows xp 64, will Abobe release a patch or upgrade to photoshop to support it?

As I just posted in the Adobe forum, I doubt that they are in any rush to issue a patch for a beta OS…
NB
Norman Black
Feb 18, 2004
Good question – but I doubt it’ll be a "patch." 😉

I cannot be a patch. The code generation for 64-bit is different. The whole executable has to change.

Norman

"Flycaster" wrote in message
"elven" wrote in message
Now that the AMD 64bit processor is in wide release and Microsoft
has
released it’s public beta of the next windows xp 64, will Abobe release a patch or upgrade to photoshop to support it?
Curious to see if anyone on this forum has heard any new concerning this.

-long time photoshop user. I’ve have every upgrade from version 2.0 to CS.
Just got a AMD 64 computer. Will install the 64 bit os beta soon.

Good question – but I doubt it’ll be a "patch." 😉

—–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–== Over 100,000 Newsgroups – 19 Different Servers! =—–
EG
Eric Gill
Feb 18, 2004
"Norman Black" wrote in news:ynzYb.8130$tL3.5934 @newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net:

Good question – but I doubt it’ll be a "patch." 😉

I cannot be a patch. The code generation for 64-bit is different. The whole executable has to change.

That depends, of course, on what is meant by "support". Adding 64-bit code to plugins that might benefit from it is (relatively) simple. Making Photoshop 64-bit clean, including the much greater memory support, does indeed involve nuke and pave.
NB
Norman Black
Feb 19, 2004
I cannot be a patch. The code generation for 64-bit is different.
The
whole executable has to change.

That depends, of course, on what is meant by "support". Adding 64-bit
code
to plugins that might benefit from it is (relatively) simple. Making Photoshop 64-bit clean, including the much greater memory support,
does
indeed involve nuke and pave.

If a plugin is 64-bit capable then Photoshop must also be so. You cannot mix 32-bit mode and 64-bit mode. You are either in one mode or the other. The only way a process can be in 64-bit mode is if the app is compiled and linked for 64-bit.

Norman
EG
Eric Gill
Feb 19, 2004
"Norman Black" wrote in news:oTTYb.9484$tL3.4048 @newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net:

I cannot be a patch. The code generation for 64-bit is different.
The
whole executable has to change.

That depends, of course, on what is meant by "support". Adding 64-bit
code
to plugins that might benefit from it is (relatively) simple. Making Photoshop 64-bit clean, including the much greater memory support,
does
indeed involve nuke and pave.

If a plugin is 64-bit capable then Photoshop must also be so. You cannot mix 32-bit mode and 64-bit mode. You are either in one mode or the other. The only way a process can be in 64-bit mode is if the app is compiled and linked for 64-bit.

Sure, sure. That, of course, explains the G5 plugins for Photoshop, and the hybrid code of OSX.
NB
Norman Black
Feb 23, 2004
I cannot be a patch. The code generation for 64-bit is different.
The
whole executable has to change.

That depends, of course, on what is meant by "support". Adding
64-bit
code
to plugins that might benefit from it is (relatively) simple.
Making
Photoshop 64-bit clean, including the much greater memory support,
does
indeed involve nuke and pave.

If a plugin is 64-bit capable then Photoshop must also be so. You
cannot
mix 32-bit mode and 64-bit mode. You are either in one mode or the other. The only way a process can be in 64-bit mode is if the app is compiled and linked for 64-bit.

Sure, sure. That, of course, explains the G5 plugins for Photoshop,
and the
hybrid code of OSX.

Other processors and other operating systems are neither here nor there when concerning Windows 64-bit and the AMD 64-bit processor extensions to IA32 (x86) architecture. The AMD processor extensions are modal. Modal meaning that when the processor is in 32-bit mode, 64-bit anything is not available. A mode switch must be done by "supervisor" priveledge code. The PowerPC architecture has always supported 64-bit in a non modal manner. Initial processors simply did not implement the 64-bit features of the architecture. An example similar to the AMD extensions is the MIPS processor where the 64-bit mode is modal. Processor "modes" exists because an identical machine code instruction has different meanings depending on the mode you are executing in. For example AMD64 redefines the single byte opcode INC and DEC instructions in 64-bit mode to enable new features.

The PowerPC had the luxury of being defined at a time of 32-bit with an eye towards 64-bit. The x86 line of processors goes back to the 16-bit days. Hence the need for "modal" extensions to a new world.

Norman
AB
Andrew Brooks
Feb 25, 2004
Norman Black wrote:
The AMD processor extensions are modal. Modal meaning that when the processor is in 32-bit mode, 64-bit anything is not available.

This is interesting; I had assumed that some 64-bit instructions would be available in 32-bit mode. That would allow a new shared C library or a new photoshop extension (like the MMX extension) to use 64-bit registers etc. for speeding up things like memory copies. I assumed that Windows XP and Photoshop 8 would already have these things! Maybe I’m too optimistic. Do you have a reference which I could read that explains things like this?

Thanks,

Andrew
NB
Norman Black
Feb 26, 2004
This is interesting; I had assumed that some 64-bit instructions would be available in 32-bit mode.

No free opcodes available for 64-bit extensions. AMD obviously decided to simplify by not using prefixes ala the 32-bit IA32 instruction set. I assume the prefixes are not really available and certainly not a linear sequence of opcodes which AMD wanted to use for their REX prefixes. This is the best thing about AMD64… the REX prefixes provide more registers (double to be exact). Not many apps care about 64-bit addressing, though Photoshop is one of these, but all applications can use the additional registers for better code generation. With the linear opcode requirement for the REX prefixes AMD changed the meaning of the single byte INC/DEC instructions. This move invalidates interoperability of 32<->64-bit modes.

The mass market will care about "64-bit" because of the performance increase due to the extra registers. It will be publicized by the media that "64-bit" computing is inherently faster, but this is not true in this case. Since the MMX extensions you could operate with 64-bit data operands. Since SSE2 you could operate on 128-bit data operands. Code that could use these extensions, mostly the SIMD features, are using those instructions so AMD64 will add nothing there.

Do you have a reference which I could read that
explains things like this?

The AMD instruction set reference manuals. I have these. I am a compiler writer by profession. You can order the manual from AMD.com. They probably have enough information for your interests online. Somewhere at Intel.com they have "their" 64-bit extensions in a downloadable PDF format.

Norman

"Andrew Brooks" wrote in message
Norman Black wrote:
The AMD processor extensions are modal. Modal meaning that when the processor is in 32-bit mode, 64-bit anything is not available.

This is interesting; I had assumed that some 64-bit instructions would be available in 32-bit mode. That would allow a new shared C library
or
a new photoshop extension (like the MMX extension) to use 64-bit registers etc. for speeding up things like memory copies. I assumed that Windows XP and Photoshop 8 would already have these things!
Maybe
I’m too optimistic. Do you have a reference which I could read that explains things like this?

Thanks,

Andrew

How to Master Sharpening in Photoshop

Give your photos a professional finish with sharpening in Photoshop. Learn to enhance details, create contrast, and prepare your images for print, web, and social media.

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