Why does PS display images so dark and saturated on XP?

T
Posted By
Toby
Jun 14, 2004
Views
764
Replies
16
Status
Closed
Apologies if this has been covered–I don’t frequent this NG very often.

I recently put together a new box and installed XP. In the past I was using Win2K, and still have PS (CS) on my second machine w/Win2K.

I notice that all my images tend to be displayed very dark and very saturated on the XP machine (in PS) as compared to that on the present and former computer running Win2K. All color management settings are the same on all machines, and I use Adobe RGB in the working space.

It is clear to see the difference when using other apps and web display of the graphics, even the Epson print preview that comes up when printing out of PS displays an image that is much lighter (higher gamma) and less saturated, and all these other display venues are pretty consistent. Only PS displays graphics (in whichever graphics format) noticeably, even radically, darker and more saturated. I’ve tried changing the color management settings to no effect.

Does anyone here have any suggestions as to further steps I might take to find out why this is happening?

TIA,

Toby

How to Improve Photoshop Performance

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MR
Mike Russell
Jun 14, 2004
Toby wrote:
Apologies if this has been covered–I don’t frequent this NG very often.

I recently put together a new box and installed XP. In the past I was using Win2K, and still have PS (CS) on my second machine w/Win2K.
I notice that all my images tend to be displayed very dark and very saturated on the XP machine (in PS) as compared to that on the present and former computer running Win2K. All color management settings are the same on all machines, and I use Adobe RGB in the working space.

It is clear to see the difference when using other apps and web display of the graphics, even the Epson print preview that comes up when printing out of PS displays an image that is much lighter (higher gamma) and less saturated, and all these other display venues are pretty consistent. Only PS displays graphics (in whichever graphics format) noticeably, even radically, darker and more saturated. I’ve tried changing the color management settings to no effect.

Does anyone here have any suggestions as to further steps I might take to find out why this is happening?

What you’re describing could be the result of a display profile whose gamma is too low. One way to get into this situation is to specify Macintosh default for the gamma value in Adobe Gamma. Try running Adobe Gamma again.

BTW- if you’re curious, you can run the free Curvemeister profile plotter action on your Adobe Monitor Settings file. If the curve bows upward, you have gamma set to a lower value than your native display. In some situations this is desirable – as when viewing Macintosh images on a PC, but normally it is not, and could result in Photoshop displaying darker images than other programs.

There are other ways to get into the same fix. For example, by running two utilities that alter the system gamma. This can happen, for example, if you have installed calibration software separate from Adobe Photoshop – run one or the other but not both. Also make sure your assigned display profile in the display properties control panel matches the name you saved your Adobe Gamma profile under.


Mike Russell
www.geigy.2y.net
T
Toby
Jun 14, 2004
Thanks Mike,

Since only PS displays dark I don’t see how it could be a display problem, since in that case all the apps should display images dark. It has got to be a setting within PS itself it seems.

Toby

"Mike Russell" wrote in message
Toby wrote:
Apologies if this has been covered–I don’t frequent this NG very often.

I recently put together a new box and installed XP. In the past I was using Win2K, and still have PS (CS) on my second machine w/Win2K.
I notice that all my images tend to be displayed very dark and very saturated on the XP machine (in PS) as compared to that on the present and former computer running Win2K. All color management settings are the same on all machines, and I use Adobe RGB in the working space.

It is clear to see the difference when using other apps and web display of the graphics, even the Epson print preview that comes up when printing out of PS displays an image that is much lighter (higher gamma) and less saturated, and all these other display venues are pretty consistent. Only PS displays graphics (in whichever graphics format) noticeably, even radically, darker and more saturated. I’ve tried changing the color management settings to no effect.

Does anyone here have any suggestions as to further steps I might take to find out why this is happening?

What you’re describing could be the result of a display profile whose
gamma
is too low. One way to get into this situation is to specify Macintosh default for the gamma value in Adobe Gamma. Try running Adobe Gamma
again.
BTW- if you’re curious, you can run the free Curvemeister profile plotter action on your Adobe Monitor Settings file. If the curve bows upward, you have gamma set to a lower value than your native display. In some situations this is desirable – as when viewing Macintosh images on a PC,
but
normally it is not, and could result in Photoshop displaying darker images than other programs.

There are other ways to get into the same fix. For example, by running two utilities that alter the system gamma. This can happen, for example, if
you
have installed calibration software separate from Adobe Photoshop – run
one
or the other but not both. Also make sure your assigned display profile
in
the display properties control panel matches the name you saved your Adobe Gamma profile under.


Mike Russell
www.geigy.2y.net

MR
Mike Russell
Jun 14, 2004
Toby wrote:
Thanks Mike,

Since only PS displays dark I don’t see how it could be a display problem, since in that case all the apps should display images dark. It has got to be a setting within PS itself it seems.

Exactly. PS is what’s called a "color aware" application. This means it modifies image color values to match the characteristics that were measured by Adobe Gamma, and stored in the color settings file.

No guarantees, but this is why I suggested that you re-run Adobe Gamma. There are other, less likely possbilities, but setting the wrong gamma is the most common one. The next most common problem is having two competing applications setting the monitor characteristics.


Mike Russell
www.curvemeister.com
www.geigy.2y.net

Toby

"Mike Russell" wrote in message
Toby wrote:
Apologies if this has been covered–I don’t frequent this NG very often.

I recently put together a new box and installed XP. In the past I was using Win2K, and still have PS (CS) on my second machine w/Win2K.

I notice that all my images tend to be displayed very dark and very saturated on the XP machine (in PS) as compared to that on the present and former computer running Win2K. All color management settings are the same on all machines, and I use Adobe RGB in the working space.

It is clear to see the difference when using other apps and web display of the graphics, even the Epson print preview that comes up when printing out of PS displays an image that is much lighter (higher gamma) and less saturated, and all these other display venues are pretty consistent. Only PS displays graphics (in whichever
graphics format) noticeably, even radically, darker and more saturated. I’ve tried changing the color management settings to no effect.

Does anyone here have any suggestions as to further steps I might take to find out why this is happening?

What you’re describing could be the result of a display profile whose gamma is too low. One way to get into this situation is to specify Macintosh default for the gamma value in Adobe Gamma. Try running Adobe Gamma again.

BTW- if you’re curious, you can run the free Curvemeister profile plotter action on your Adobe Monitor Settings file. If the curve bows upward, you have gamma set to a lower value than your native display. In some situations this is desirable – as when viewing Macintosh images on a PC, but normally it is not, and could result in Photoshop displaying darker images than other programs.
There are other ways to get into the same fix. For example, by running two utilities that alter the system gamma. This can happen, for example, if you have installed calibration software separate from Adobe Photoshop – run one or the other but not both. Also make sure your assigned display profile in the display properties control panel matches the name you saved your Adobe Gamma profile under. —

Mike Russell
www.geigy.2y.net
H
Hecate
Jun 15, 2004
On 13 Jun 2004 22:42:20 -0500, "Toby" wrote:

Apologies if this has been covered–I don’t frequent this NG very often.
I recently put together a new box and installed XP. In the past I was using Win2K, and still have PS (CS) on my second machine w/Win2K.
I notice that all my images tend to be displayed very dark and very saturated on the XP machine (in PS) as compared to that on the present and former computer running Win2K. All color management settings are the same on all machines, and I use Adobe RGB in the working space.

Do you have identical graphics cards and identical monitors? Are the monitors calibrated identically with the same calibration tool?
Are you suing the same colour space on both systems?



Hecate

veni, vidi, reliqui
T
Toby
Jun 15, 2004
Sounds good, I’ll give it a shot. As I never ran Adobe Gamma in the first place this might certainly do it 😉 I assumed it applied to all apps equally.

Thanks again,

Toby
"Mike Russell" wrote in message
Toby wrote:
Thanks Mike,

Since only PS displays dark I don’t see how it could be a display problem, since in that case all the apps should display images dark. It has got to be a setting within PS itself it seems.

Exactly. PS is what’s called a "color aware" application. This means it modifies image color values to match the characteristics that were
measured
by Adobe Gamma, and stored in the color settings file.

No guarantees, but this is why I suggested that you re-run Adobe Gamma. There are other, less likely possbilities, but setting the wrong gamma is the most common one. The next most common problem is having two competing applications setting the monitor characteristics.


Mike Russell
www.curvemeister.com
www.geigy.2y.net

Toby

"Mike Russell" wrote in message
Toby wrote:
Apologies if this has been covered–I don’t frequent this NG very often.

I recently put together a new box and installed XP. In the past I was using Win2K, and still have PS (CS) on my second machine w/Win2K.

I notice that all my images tend to be displayed very dark and very saturated on the XP machine (in PS) as compared to that on the present and former computer running Win2K. All color management settings are the same on all machines, and I use Adobe RGB in the working space.

It is clear to see the difference when using other apps and web display of the graphics, even the Epson print preview that comes up when printing out of PS displays an image that is much lighter (higher gamma) and less saturated, and all these other display venues are pretty consistent. Only PS displays graphics (in whichever
graphics format) noticeably, even radically, darker and more saturated. I’ve tried changing the color management settings to no effect.

Does anyone here have any suggestions as to further steps I might take to find out why this is happening?

What you’re describing could be the result of a display profile whose gamma is too low. One way to get into this situation is to specify Macintosh default for the gamma value in Adobe Gamma. Try running Adobe Gamma again.

BTW- if you’re curious, you can run the free Curvemeister profile plotter action on your Adobe Monitor Settings file. If the curve bows upward, you have gamma set to a lower value than your native display. In some situations this is desirable – as when viewing Macintosh images on a PC, but normally it is not, and could result in Photoshop displaying darker images than other programs.
There are other ways to get into the same fix. For example, by running two utilities that alter the system gamma. This can happen, for example, if you have installed calibration software separate from Adobe Photoshop – run one or the other but not both. Also make sure your assigned display profile in the display properties control panel matches the name you saved your Adobe Gamma profile under. —

Mike Russell
www.geigy.2y.net

T
Toby
Jun 15, 2004
I’m using the same monitor that I had on my old system, calibrated with a Pantone Spyder. It’s a new graphics card but why would that affect PS and not ACDSee and IE and my printer driver?

Toby
"Hecate" wrote in message
On 13 Jun 2004 22:42:20 -0500, "Toby" wrote:

Apologies if this has been covered–I don’t frequent this NG very often.
I recently put together a new box and installed XP. In the past I was
using
Win2K, and still have PS (CS) on my second machine w/Win2K.
I notice that all my images tend to be displayed very dark and very saturated on the XP machine (in PS) as compared to that on the present
and
former computer running Win2K. All color management settings are the same
on
all machines, and I use Adobe RGB in the working space.

Do you have identical graphics cards and identical monitors? Are the monitors calibrated identically with the same calibration tool?
Are you suing the same colour space on both systems?



Hecate

veni, vidi, reliqui
T
Toby
Jun 15, 2004
Thanks Mike,

Adjusting Adobe Gamma and then recalibrating did the trick. Actually I wasn’t even aware that Gamma had been installed. I don’t remember a dialogue for it coming up. Anyway things look spot on now. I appreciate the time you took to answer.

Toby

"Toby" wrote in message
Sounds good, I’ll give it a shot. As I never ran Adobe Gamma in the first place this might certainly do it 😉 I assumed it applied to all apps equally.

Thanks again,

Toby
"Mike Russell" wrote in message
Toby wrote:
Thanks Mike,

Since only PS displays dark I don’t see how it could be a display problem, since in that case all the apps should display images dark. It has got to be a setting within PS itself it seems.

Exactly. PS is what’s called a "color aware" application. This means
it
modifies image color values to match the characteristics that were
measured
by Adobe Gamma, and stored in the color settings file.

No guarantees, but this is why I suggested that you re-run Adobe Gamma. There are other, less likely possbilities, but setting the wrong gamma
is
the most common one. The next most common problem is having two
competing
applications setting the monitor characteristics.


Mike Russell
www.curvemeister.com
www.geigy.2y.net

Toby

"Mike Russell" wrote in message
Toby wrote:
Apologies if this has been covered–I don’t frequent this NG very often.

I recently put together a new box and installed XP. In the past I was using Win2K, and still have PS (CS) on my second machine w/Win2K.

I notice that all my images tend to be displayed very dark and very saturated on the XP machine (in PS) as compared to that on the present and former computer running Win2K. All color management settings are the same on all machines, and I use Adobe RGB in the working space.

It is clear to see the difference when using other apps and web display of the graphics, even the Epson print preview that comes up when printing out of PS displays an image that is much lighter (higher gamma) and less saturated, and all these other display venues are pretty consistent. Only PS displays graphics (in whichever
graphics format) noticeably, even radically, darker and more saturated. I’ve tried changing the color management settings to no effect.

Does anyone here have any suggestions as to further steps I might take to find out why this is happening?

What you’re describing could be the result of a display profile whose gamma is too low. One way to get into this situation is to specify Macintosh default for the gamma value in Adobe Gamma. Try running Adobe Gamma again.

BTW- if you’re curious, you can run the free Curvemeister profile plotter action on your Adobe Monitor Settings file. If the curve bows upward, you have gamma set to a lower value than your native display. In some situations this is desirable – as when viewing Macintosh images on a PC, but normally it is not, and could result in Photoshop displaying darker images than other programs.
There are other ways to get into the same fix. For example, by running two utilities that alter the system gamma. This can happen, for example, if you have installed calibration software separate from Adobe Photoshop – run one or the other but not both. Also make sure your assigned display profile in the display properties control panel matches the name you saved your Adobe Gamma profile under. —

Mike Russell
www.geigy.2y.net

H
Hecate
Jun 16, 2004
On 15 Jun 2004 01:54:32 -0500, "Toby" wrote:

I’m using the same monitor that I had on my old system, calibrated with a Pantone Spyder. It’s a new graphics card but why would that affect PS and not ACDSee and IE and my printer driver?
The reason I mention it is that different graphics cards will have different drivers. It’s quite possible that you may not see the same on screen results with identical computers if one has, say, an ATi card and the other a Matrox. I know it should be the same, logically, but drivers do make a difference.



Hecate

veni, vidi, reliqui
J
Jimmy
Jun 16, 2004
In another response you indicated you used Adobe Gamma to correct the problem, but here you indicate you use a Spyder. Just exactly what are you using for your monitor calibration software and how often do you recalibrate? With a new system with a different OS it would be reasonable to consider that a monitor profile may need to be changed, and that printer profiles may or may/not change. IE uses the default profile, calibrated or not.

"Toby" wrote in message
I’m using the same monitor that I had on my old system, calibrated with a Pantone Spyder. It’s a new graphics card but why would that affect PS and not ACDSee and IE and my printer driver?

Toby
H
Hecate
Jun 17, 2004
On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 07:58:30 -0500, "Jimmy"
wrote:

In another response you indicated you used Adobe Gamma to correct the problem, but here you indicate you use a Spyder. Just exactly what are you using for your monitor calibration software and how often do you recalibrate? With a new system with a different OS it would be reasonable to consider that a monitor profile may need to be changed, and that printer profiles may or may/not change. IE uses the default profile, calibrated or not.
Good catch. You should use a Spider *or* Gamma, but not both.



Hecate

veni, vidi, reliqui
T
Toby
Jun 22, 2004
This is what I thought too. OTOH after setting Adobe Gamma and then recalibrating with the Spyder things seem to be in good nick. Puzzling. Perhaps I should get rid of Adobe Gamma completely–can anyone tell me how to shut it off/remove it?

Toby

"Hecate" wrote in message
On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 07:58:30 -0500, "Jimmy"
wrote:

In another response you indicated you used Adobe Gamma to correct the problem, but here you indicate you use a Spyder. Just exactly what are
you
using for your monitor calibration software and how often do you recalibrate? With a new system with a different OS it would be
reasonable
to consider that a monitor profile may need to be changed, and that
printer
profiles may or may/not change. IE uses the default profile, calibrated
or
not.
Good catch. You should use a Spider *or* Gamma, but not both.


Hecate

veni, vidi, reliqui
H
Hecate
Jun 22, 2004
On 21 Jun 2004 19:20:59 -0500, "Toby" wrote:

This is what I thought too. OTOH after setting Adobe Gamma and then recalibrating with the Spyder things seem to be in good nick. Puzzling. Perhaps I should get rid of Adobe Gamma completely–can anyone tell me how to shut it off/remove it?
Trouble is, you’re then using, or trying to, the profile set up by the Spyder, and then one you set up in Gamma. What you need to do is calibrate with the Spyder and then make sure that PS is using the profile you create there. Then Gamma won’t matter.

You should make sure Gamma doesn’t load at start up. Someone else will have to tell you that, because it’s late and I just don’t remember (I use Gretag MacBeth and haven’t even set up Gamma).



Hecate

veni, vidi, reliqui
AM
Andrew Morton
Jun 22, 2004
You should make sure Gamma doesn’t load at start up. Someone else will have to tell you that…

http://www.mlin.net/StartupCPL.shtml works well.

Andrew
N
nomail
Jun 22, 2004
Toby wrote:

This is what I thought too. OTOH after setting Adobe Gamma and then recalibrating with the Spyder things seem to be in good nick. Puzzling. Perhaps I should get rid of Adobe Gamma completely–can anyone tell me how to shut it off/remove it?

Yes, you should remove Adobe Gamma completely. I thought this was done automatically when you install the Spyder software…


Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/
M
Madsen
Jun 22, 2004
Johan W. Elzenga wrote:

Yes, you should remove Adobe Gamma completely. I thought this was done automatically when you install the Spyder software…

No need to remove Adobe Gamma. It’s enough to remove Adobe Gamma Loader from the startup folder, which should happen automatically when the Spyder software is installed. If not then remove it manually (Documents and Settings\{User}\Start Menu\Programs\Startup).


Regards
Madsen
T
Toby
Jun 24, 2004
Thanks everybody. I’ve got things pretty WYSIWYG now.

Toby

"Thomas G. Madsen" wrote in message
Johan W. Elzenga wrote:

Yes, you should remove Adobe Gamma completely. I thought this was done automatically when you install the Spyder software…

No need to remove Adobe Gamma. It’s enough to remove Adobe Gamma Loader from the startup folder, which should happen automatically when the Spyder software is installed. If not then remove it manually (Documents and Settings\{User}\Start Menu\Programs\Startup).

Regards
Madsen

How to Improve Photoshop Performance

Learn how to optimize Photoshop for maximum speed, troubleshoot common issues, and keep your projects organized so that you can work faster than ever before!

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