Help with ICC profile

P
Posted By
peter
Jan 27, 2006
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599
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I’m trying to take some pictures for a brochure. They are of different species of wood, and need to be very color correct. The printing company says I can buy the ICC profile for the printer they will use. First, can you import ICC profiles into PS 7? Second, how much help will it be, bearing in mind that I’m learning as I go on this project.

Thanks,

Peter
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Mike Russell
Jan 27, 2006
"peter" wrote in message
I’m trying to take some pictures for a brochure. They are of different species of wood, and need to be very color correct. The printing company says I can buy the ICC profile for the printer they will use. First, can you import ICC profiles into PS 7? Second, how much help will it be, bearing in mind that I’m learning as I go on this project.

An ICC profile will not guarantee accurate portrayal of wood colors. More important than the printer’s profile would be to 1) get physical samples of each species of wood, and 2) get proofs of each image before it is printed, and match them to the wood colors.
—

Mike Russell
www.curvemeister.com
P
peter
Jan 27, 2006
Yes, I was just trying to save too many trips back and forth to the printer. I can get the species color correct on my monitor, but I was hoping the ICC profile would then assure me they will print the exact same color I see on my monitor. I fear it’s not that simple. Anyway, thanks Mike.

Peter
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gpsman
Jan 27, 2006
peter wrote:
I’m trying to take some pictures for a brochure. They are of different species of wood, and need to be very color correct. The printing company says I can buy the ICC profile for the printer they will use. First, can you import ICC profiles into PS 7? Second, how much help will it be, bearing in mind that I’m learning as I go on this project.
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Assuming your printer is local… you’re going to have to tell them you want "color approval" and inspect the run yourself. Or you could leave the wood samples with the printer requesting they match color as close as possible.

At any rate, the monitor itself is set to the ICC profile, not PS (AFAIK). And the ICC profile is possibly already on your machine, they’re just going to tell you which one they use. Is the ICC profile $10,000… or $10? You could probably call back, act ignorant and ask what profile they use and get some idiot to tell you for $0.

I don’t know how you might reconcile your monitor with someone else’s monitor and/or press and the ICC profile. I doubt 2 different model monitors will display the "exact" same colors, and you wouldn’t be able to tell the difference unless they were side by side.
—–

– gpsman
TN
Tesco News
Jan 27, 2006
"peter" wrote in message
I’m trying to take some pictures for a brochure. They are of different species of wood, and need to be very color correct. The printing company says I can buy the ICC profile for the printer they will use. First, can you import ICC profiles into PS 7? Second, how much help will it be, bearing in mind that I’m learning as I go on this project.

Thanks,

Peter

Hi.

First things first. ICC Profiles are kept in the OS, not in Ps. In Windows they are in the Colour Folder. In XP it is
Windows > System 32 > Spool > Drivers > Colour.

Any ICC Profile can be copied into that Folder, and Photoshop can make use of it.

You will need to find out from the Printers what Working Space Profile they want tagged onto your Image when you deliver it to them. (Probably – sRGB).

And will their system correct from that Working Space using their Printer Profile. (Probably – Yes)

AND you would also need to know what "Intent" requires to be applied, because the correction engine has several different ways of dealing with colours which are Out of Gamut.

You would then, only use their Printer Profile in View > Proof Colours so that you can check on screen that you have got the correct colour of wood. ( Not Exact because the screen is transmitted illumination and a print is reflected).

This all assumes that your Monitor and theirs are Calibrated correctly, and being viewed under the same lighting conditions as when they were calibrated.
It will help get you fairly close, but Samples of the wood Colour and a request for an Exact Match would be the easiest if most expensive way.

You will be aware that Printed Brochures usually carry a Caveat about the displayed Colours not being guaranteed exact.

Roy G
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nomail
Jan 27, 2006
peter wrote:

I’m trying to take some pictures for a brochure. They are of different species of wood, and need to be very color correct. The printing company says I can buy the ICC profile for the printer they will use. First, can you import ICC profiles into PS 7? Second, how much help will it be, bearing in mind that I’m learning as I go on this project.

In order to get accurate color, you don’t need a printer profile (the printer has got that anyway), but you need a CAMERA profile.

—
Johan W. Elzenga johan<<at>>johanfoto.nl Editor / Photographer http://www.johanfoto.nl/
CJ
C J Southern
Jan 29, 2006
"peter" wrote in message
Yes, I was just trying to save too many trips back and forth to the printer. I can get the species color correct on my monitor, but I was hoping the ICC profile would then assure me they will print the exact same color I see on my monitor. I fear it’s not that simple. Anyway, thanks Mike.

Peter, the immediate issue you have is the fact that you have an uncalibrated monitor – so the colours you’re seeing on the screen don’t necessarily bare a close relationship to what’s stored in the file representing the image. It’s a bit like following a hand-drawn map – just because you’re following the map doesn’t mean to say you’ll be where the map says you are.

A camera profile has been mentioned, but this isn’t as critical as getting your monitor calibrated – a camera profile only helps get the colours in the ballpark initially – with a calibrated monitor, once the colours are looking right then it doesn’t matter if they were right or wrong in the first place.

If you’re able to deliver the data to the printer in a device-independant format then the printer can render the file using their own profile.
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peter
Jan 29, 2006
Ok, CJ, thanks. Now can you recommend the best way to calibrate a monitor? I mean, I dont even know if it uses some kind of software, or what. I will research it, but I thought I’d ask you too.

Thanks again,

Peter
CJ
C J Southern
Jan 29, 2006
"peter" wrote in message
Ok, CJ, thanks. Now can you recommend the best way to calibrate a monitor? I mean, I dont even know if it uses some kind of software, or what. I will research it, but I thought I’d ask you too.

There’s really only 2 ways that I can think of …

1. If you go into control panel, look for an applett called "Adobe Gamma" – it’s a poor poor cousin to option 2 below, but it’s better than nothing.

2. Get your monitor calibrated using calibration hardware & software (such as spyder2pro) – it’s a bit of an investment to buy this stuff yourself, but it’s possible you might be able to find someone in your area who can build you a monitor profile for a small fee?

Plan "C" might be to get it looking right on your screen – save the file in a device independant format (such as Adobe RGB or LAB) – and review it on a calibrated system (such as any in-house publisher would probably have – and make any adjustments there).

The problem you have is that the photos you’re opening in photoshop are in what’s termed a "device dependant" format – the quantities of Red – Green – Blue "ink" are specified just fine, but the problem is that just what shades the "ink" is isn’t defined. eg the Red channel of your camera might be a completely different shade of "red" in your printer and on your screen. So to "complete the picture" the file has to tell how much red – green – blue to use, but also include a definition file (called a profile) that describes the red – green and blue – and you don’t have that profile.

Not having a camera profile wouldn’t be a problem if you could just get the colours looking right on the monitor – but you’ve then got the same problem in that the monitor is putting it’s own default interpretation on what the RGB numbers mean.

Welcome to "Colour Management 101" 🙁
P
peter
Jan 29, 2006
Yeah, the more I learn about this stuff, the more I realize how much I don’t know!

Thanks again,

Peter
CJ
C J Southern
Jan 30, 2006
"peter" wrote in message

Yeah, the more I learn about this stuff, the more I realize how much I don’t know!

You and me both.

I grabbed a copy of Real World Colour Management (2nd edition), and am on my 2nd read of it – as I try these things out. It’s worth the cost if you really want to get into it, but not for the faint hearted.
P
peter
Jan 30, 2006
Thanks for the recommendation.

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