General advice for printing from photoshop

CB
Posted By
Captain Blammo
Feb 9, 2005
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638
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I’ve been messing around with photoshop for long enough, but haven’t done anything much with printing. What kind of issues and procedures am I looking at to get an optimal print?

I am going to look into colour profiling, as it seems to be a must. Does anything else spring readily to mind?

Currently, if I want to print an image, I use the scaling option in the "Print with preview" dialog to fit it on the page. Is this a reasonable habit? I am assuming that the printer will print as much detail as it is capable of if I do this. Is there a better way to go about things?

Also, I have heard some people talk about upsampling their images before printing. Is this a good idea, and how far should one upsample images for a given image/printer resolution combination?

Thanks for any help and pointers

Ewan

MacBook Pro 16” Mockups 🔥

– in 4 materials (clay versions included)

– 12 scenes

– 48 MacBook Pro 16″ mockups

– 6000 x 4500 px

H
Hecate
Feb 10, 2005
On Wed, 09 Feb 2005 20:12:35 GMT, "Captain Blammo" wrote:

I’ve been messing around with photoshop for long enough, but haven’t done anything much with printing. What kind of issues and procedures am I looking at to get an optimal print?

Colour management.

I am going to look into colour profiling, as it seems to be a must. Does anything else spring readily to mind?

See above. And set aside a few weeks to get a basic understanding of the subject.



Hecate – The Real One

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B
Brian
Feb 10, 2005
Hecate wrote:
On Wed, 09 Feb 2005 20:12:35 GMT, "Captain Blammo" wrote:

I’ve been messing around with photoshop for long enough, but haven’t done anything much with printing. What kind of issues and procedures am I looking at to get an optimal print?

Colour management.

I am going to look into colour profiling, as it seems to be a must. Does anything else spring readily to mind?

See above. And set aside a few weeks to get a basic understanding of the subject.



Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

As well as colour management, resolution is the next most important thing. Have your image at the correct resolution. Assuming you are printing from an inkjet printer, find out (by experimenting) what resolution seems to be the best for your particular printer. You may fing there is little difference between 150dpi through to 300dpi, in which case you would have the image set at 150dpi at the size you want to print it!
At the size you want to print it means….say you want a 10" x 8" print and you found 150dpi the best resolution for printing on your particular printer. You need to have your image sized at (10 x 150dpi) by (8 x 150dpi) = 1500 x 1200 pixels. So, scan at a higher resolution than this, say 300 dpi, perform your editing, resize it down to 1500 x 1200 (resolution set at 150dpi), sharpen the image as needed, and then print.

Brian.
H
Hecate
Feb 10, 2005
On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 16:44:16 +1100, Brian
wrote:

As well as colour management, resolution is the next most important thing. Have your image at the correct resolution. Assuming you are printing from an inkjet printer, find out (by experimenting) what resolution seems to be the best for your particular printer. You may fing there is little difference between 150dpi through to 300dpi, in which case you would have the image set at 150dpi at the size you want to print it!
At the size you want to print it means….say you want a 10" x 8" print and you found 150dpi the best resolution for printing on your particular printer. You need to have your image sized at (10 x 150dpi) by (8 x 150dpi) = 1500 x 1200 pixels. So, scan at a higher resolution than this, say 300 dpi, perform your editing, resize it down to 1500 x 1200 (resolution set at 150dpi), sharpen the image as needed, and then print.
I agree, except PPI *not* DPI. Dpi is what his printer uses 🙂



Hecate – The Real One

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MR
Mike Russell
Feb 11, 2005
Captain Blammo wrote:
I’ve been messing around with photoshop for long enough, but haven’t done anything much with printing. What kind of issues and procedures am I looking at to get an optimal print?

Hi again Cap’n,

You can do very well if you spend an hour or so setting up your printer to match your screen reasonably closely. Start by reading Ian Lyon’s web page for your particular version of Photoshop, and setting up your system accordingly. Here’s Ian’s link for CS:
http://www.computer-darkroom.com/ps8-colour/ps8_1.htm

I am going to look into colour profiling, as it seems to be a must. Does anything else spring readily to mind?

Yes – my advice is to start by not going into color profiling, if by that you mean buying equipment to generate your own screen and printer profiles.

I realize fully that there are others in this group who disagree profoundly with this, and I concede that profiling equipment is appropriate and necessary for professional work. This is particularly true if you send materials out to be printed, or receive prepared work from others, most of the profiling instruments and software are overkill for a single monitor, scanner, and printer setup. It’s also true that people with adequate money, and the desire for additional accuracy, also have a valid reason to purchase profiling equipment. If you go that route, keep in mind that whatever you buy, there will always be additional equipment and software that costs more, and promises even more accurate results, and even with a lab full of equipment, there is an effect called viewer metamerism – no two pairs of eyes are precisely the same.

So, at this time, I recommend carefully calibrating your monitor using Adobe Gamma, then configuring your printer either with the canned profiles shipped with the printer, or other profiles you may download free from the net. The Ian Lyons page has some satisfactory profiles for several Epson printers.

You may also decide to try a variety of driver settings in your printer’s configuration settings. Whether you use the manufacturer’s canned profiles downloaded profiles, or modify the device driver settings, it is good to evaluate your results using a test strip. You can make one yourself in Photoshop by posterizing a gradient, or use the one from Curvemeister, which includes a variety of flesh tones. Make sure you can distinguish all the squares, and that the black and white squares are as dark as possible, and that there is no systematic color cast to the test strip.

The url for the test strip is here:
http://www.curvemeister.com/downloads/TestStrip/digital_test _strip.htm

Having said this, if you have more money than sense, a great desire for perfection and an infatuation with equipment over results, or if you simply want to experiment, you can purchase a colorimeter for $100 or so that will do a good job of calibrating your monitor. Additional, more expensive, devices are available to calibrate your printer.

Currently, if I want to print an image, I use the scaling option in the "Print with preview" dialog to fit it on the page. Is this a reasonable habit? I am assuming that the printer will print as much detail as it is capable of if I do this. Is there a better way to go about things?

I use it all the time – fit to image to page.

Also, I have heard some people talk about upsampling their images before printing. Is this a good idea, and how far should one upsample images for a given image/printer resolution combination?

In general it is good to do the upsampling yourself in Photoshop, and sharpen the image manually for best results. No one can give you a universal answer to how do do this, and there are even some who believe that sharpening is the invention of the devil. My suggestion is to resize in Photoshop to 320 pixels per inch, and then start with Unsharp Mask, radius
1.6, 60%. For even better results, convert to Lab, and sharpen only the
Lightness channel. I generally do this for my 13×19 prints, and don’t bother for 8×10’s.

Thanks for any help and pointers

You’re very welcome – I hope I’ve helped you get good results. —

Mike Russell
www.curvemeister.com
www.geigy.2y.net
H
Hecate
Feb 11, 2005
On Fri, 11 Feb 2005 00:46:16 GMT, "Mike Russell" wrote:

Captain Blammo wrote:
I’ve been messing around with photoshop for long enough, but haven’t done anything much with printing. What kind of issues and procedures am I looking at to get an optimal print?

Hi again Cap’n,

You can do very well if you spend an hour or so setting up your printer to match your screen reasonably closely. Start by reading Ian Lyon’s web page for your particular version of Photoshop, and setting up your system accordingly. Here’s Ian’s link for CS:
http://www.computer-darkroom.com/ps8-colour/ps8_1.htm

I am going to look into colour profiling, as it seems to be a must. Does anything else spring readily to mind?

Yes – my advice is to start by not going into color profiling, if by that you mean buying equipment to generate your own screen and printer profiles.
I realize fully that there are others in this group who disagree profoundly with this, and I concede that profiling equipment is appropriate and necessary for professional work.

Actually, I’d agree. He should *read* about it first. A lot. 😉



Hecate – The Real One

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CB
Captain Blammo
Feb 13, 2005
Thanks very much for the advice and info. I am indeed not sending or receiving images, so incredibly precise colour management isn’t a huge necessity for me. I’ll use the more basic techniques. Thanks for the link.

In general it is good to do the upsampling yourself in Photoshop, and sharpen the image manually for best results. No one can give you a universal answer to how do do this, and there are even some who believe
that
sharpening is the invention of the devil. My suggestion is to resize in Photoshop to 320 pixels per inch, and then start with Unsharp Mask, radius
1.6, 60%. For even better results, convert to Lab, and sharpen only the
Lightness channel. I generally do this for my 13×19 prints, and don’t bother for 8×10’s.

So what would you suggest for an Epson Stylus 2000P? It says it is capable of 720x1440dpi, does this mean that I should upsample to 1440ppi before printing for optimum results? I have heard that anything over 300ppi is unnecessary, but since the printer apparently doesn’t print at resolutions lower than 720dpi (I assume 720×1440 means it has 2 resolutions it can print at), should I upsample everything to 720ppi, at least? Is it ever worth upsampling beyond the resolution of your printer?

I assume dpi and ppi the same thing, apart from ppi refers to an image in memory, and dpi refers to dots on paper that aren’t necessarily in a neat grid. 300dpi printing still requires a 300ppi image though, yes (assuming no interpolation on the part of the printer)?

Ewan
H
Hecate
Feb 14, 2005
On Sun, 13 Feb 2005 19:25:33 GMT, "Captain Blammo" wrote:

Thanks very much for the advice and info. I am indeed not sending or receiving images, so incredibly precise colour management isn’t a huge necessity for me. I’ll use the more basic techniques. Thanks for the link.
In general it is good to do the upsampling yourself in Photoshop, and sharpen the image manually for best results. No one can give you a universal answer to how do do this, and there are even some who believe
that
sharpening is the invention of the devil. My suggestion is to resize in Photoshop to 320 pixels per inch, and then start with Unsharp Mask, radius
1.6, 60%. For even better results, convert to Lab, and sharpen only the
Lightness channel. I generally do this for my 13×19 prints, and don’t bother for 8×10’s.

So what would you suggest for an Epson Stylus 2000P? It says it is capable of 720x1440dpi, does this mean that I should upsample to 1440ppi before printing for optimum results?

The native resolution for the printer is 720 dpi, IIRC (it might be 360 dpi). So your ideal ppi is 360. Then you can print at 360 dpi or 720 dpi or the max res if you want. (With the 2000P I’d go for a 360 ppi image printed at 720dpi).

I have heard that anything over 300ppi is
unnecessary,

Rubbish. Ideal ppi is the one that fits with a fraction or multiple of the printer native resolution. 300 dpi is fine for a printer which uses that – Epson’s give better results when you match the native resolution as above.

but since the printer apparently doesn’t print at resolutions lower than 720dpi (I assume 720×1440 means it has 2 resolutions it can print at), should I upsample everything to 720ppi, at least?

Your printer will print at whatever dpi you select up to the maximum resolution.

Is it ever worth
upsampling beyond the resolution of your printer?

You are obviously mixing up image resolution (PPI) for printing and printer resolution (dpi).

I assume dpi and ppi the same thing, apart from ppi refers to an image in memory, and dpi refers to dots on paper that aren’t necessarily in a neat grid. 300dpi printing still requires a 300ppi image though, yes (assuming no interpolation on the part of the printer)?

No, they aren’t the same at all. See above.

Note PPI= Pixels per inch (the image resolution of the image you are going to print)

DPI= Dots Per Inch (the resolution at which your printer is printing your whatever PPI image).



Hecate – The Real One

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R
Ryadia
Feb 14, 2005
Hecate wrote:
I assume dpi and ppi the same thing, apart from ppi refers to an image in memory, and dpi refers to dots on paper that aren’t necessarily in a neat grid. 300dpi printing still requires a 300ppi image though, yes (assuming no interpolation on the part of the printer)?

No, they aren’t the same at all. See above.

Note PPI= Pixels per inch (the image resolution of the image you are going to print)

DPI= Dots Per Inch (the resolution at which your printer is printing your whatever PPI image).
You might care to seek out a printing application called Qimage. This program uses an advanced algorithm to resample your image to what suits the printer by a process called Interpolation. Doe it up and down in size.

All printer drivers (well the photographic ones) resample your image to suit the printer. Even when you send an otherwise correctly dimensioned image to be printed, the drivers will resample it to suit the printer.

This might all sound confusing to new users but this is the Grey art of printing. Qimage does things a little differently. It knows from the printer what it’s ideal density of pixels (dot to some) actually is and resamples the image to that size before sending the data to the printer.

Under most circumstances this results in better looking prints than if you did it from Photoshop. I can’t detect much difference between a Photoshop image sent at 180 dpi and one sent at 400 dpi other than the extra time taken to make the print.

I can see quite an improvement when I use Qimage to print the file. As Mike said earlier, under 8"x10" there is not a lot of value in any printing improvement procedures but over that and the value of proper procedures can be seen. I think you can get a free trial of Qimage if you wish to try it.

Doug
H
Hecate
Feb 14, 2005
On Mon, 14 Feb 2005 21:26:41 +1000, Ryadia wrote:

Under most circumstances this results in better looking prints than if you did it from Photoshop. I can’t detect much difference between a Photoshop image sent at 180 dpi and one sent at 400 dpi other than the extra time taken to make the print.

Well, there’s your problem. I usually use PPI and 360 at that 😉

I can see quite an improvement when I use Qimage to print the file. As Mike said earlier, under 8"x10" there is not a lot of value in any printing improvement procedures but over that and the value of proper procedures can be seen. I think you can get a free trial of Qimage if you wish to try it.
Tried it and found it wasn’t as good as the control I had with PS or InDesign, or…

YMMV. 🙂



Hecate – The Real One

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R
Ryadia
Feb 14, 2005
Hecate wrote:

Tried it and found it wasn’t as good as the control I had with PS or InDesign, or…
Ahhh Heacte,
Did I even suggest you could benefit from anything I said? I just offered advise to someone having a few issues with the humungus facility in Photoshop we loosely refer to as "printing".

I actually get better results printing photographs to one of my plotters (HP designjet) by importing the photo into Corel Draw and using that program to make the print. It is the only way I can print photos past about 4 feet long (wide to some) due to Photoshop’s ‘issue’ with very large prints.

And before you ask… I sometimes make wallpaper from photographs in 2 foot wide sections. And no… You can’t see any. Not yet at any rate, I don’t have time to put up examples but I will when (if) the workload slows.

Doug
H
Hecate
Feb 16, 2005
On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 09:36:13 +1000, Ryadia wrote:

Hecate wrote:

Tried it and found it wasn’t as good as the control I had with PS or InDesign, or…
Ahhh Heacte,
Did I even suggest you could benefit from anything I said? I just offered advise to someone having a few issues with the humungus facility in Photoshop we loosely refer to as "printing".

Nope, but I felt the OP should get more than one view of the product. Like everything else, if you can download a trial version, the person should try it out themselves and see what they think of course.

I actually get better results printing photographs to one of my plotters (HP designjet) by importing the photo into Corel Draw and using that program to make the print. It is the only way I can print photos past about 4 feet long (wide to some) due to Photoshop’s ‘issue’ with very large prints.

I can understand that 😉

And before you ask… I sometimes make wallpaper from photographs in 2 foot wide sections. And no… You can’t see any. Not yet at any rate, I don’t have time to put up examples but I will when (if) the workload slows.

That would be interesting 🙂



Hecate – The Real One

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CB
Captain Blammo
Feb 17, 2005
Well, thanks again to everyone for the tips. I have a much better understanding of what I’m doing now. I’ll try QImage at some point, and it’s nice to know the issues that photoshop has – especially the 4ft limit.

Ewan
S
Stephan
Feb 18, 2005
Ryadia wrote:
Hecate wrote:


Tried it and found it wasn’t as good as the control I had with PS or InDesign, or…
Ahhh Heacte,
Did I even suggest you could benefit from anything I said? I just offered advise to someone having a few issues with the humungus facility in Photoshop we loosely refer to as "printing".
I actually get better results printing photographs to one of my plotters (HP designjet) by importing the photo into Corel Draw and using that program to make the print. It is the only way I can print photos past about 4 feet long (wide to some) due to Photoshop’s ‘issue’ with very large prints.

I print over 4 feet and don’t have any problems

snip

Stephan
R
Ryadia
Feb 18, 2005
Stephan wrote:
I print over 4 feet and don’t have any problems

snip

Stephan

Oh yes but not all of us can leap a tall building in a single stride. Adobe recognize the problem. It is intermitent and not always a function of the printer drivers as someone (you perhaps) suggested regarding Epson plotters. The program simply doesn’t recognize some features of some plotter drivers which it should. "Made for Windows certification" is supposed to do away with these anomalies. So who is at fault?… Surely not Adobe? 🙂

Doug
H
Hecate
Feb 19, 2005
On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 17:13:10 +1000, Ryadia wrote:

Stephan wrote:
I print over 4 feet and don’t have any problems

snip

Stephan

Oh yes but not all of us can leap a tall building in a single stride. Adobe recognize the problem. It is intermitent and not always a function of the printer drivers as someone (you perhaps) suggested regarding Epson plotters. The program simply doesn’t recognize some features of some plotter drivers which it should. "Made for Windows certification" is supposed to do away with these anomalies. So who is at fault?… Surely not Adobe? 🙂
No, actually, it’s the printer manufacturers. I’m sick of loading up drivers that are unsigned and unapproved simply because the printer manufacturers can’t get their act together. The same is true of scanners. They had two years warning before Win2k came out fer chrissake and now we’re on Win XP SP2 and they *still* expect us to run their printers with their f**cked up drivers.

</end rant> 😉



Hecate – The Real One

veni, vidi, reliqui

MacBook Pro 16” Mockups 🔥

– in 4 materials (clay versions included)

– 12 scenes

– 48 MacBook Pro 16″ mockups

– 6000 x 4500 px

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